Should CPAT be made less intense so more women can pass?

There has been a lot of talk going around in the Fire and EMS field about a few women wanting to take legal action against departments because CPAT is to hard for women to pass and some even feel it is a way to keep women out of the fire service. I'm not sure if that is so because there are a lot of men who fail it also! I know women who have passed and they passed with ease! I think its a matter of how bad you really want it! I think it truely sets a fair minimum standard for men and women because it reflects the stamina and strenth needed to perform the job and not if you're male or female! What are your thoughts?

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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on April 19, 2009 at 4:21pm
Yes.
Permalink Reply by David Schnitker on April 19, 2009 at 7:23pm
Let me throw this into the mix, Forget about the gender issue, what about the volunteers, should they have to pass as well and how often? Remember alot of the volunteers simply do not have access to a gym or even work out equipment at the stations, Most work other full time jobs and have families, and now with keeping up on all the ceu's for fire and ems as well. Then add retirement into the mix, there is a lot of firefighters that never retire from the service and many who do, don't until they are in there 70's or older. I am 100% in favor of everyone being physically fit and fit to do the job, but there is also the finacial impact. somebody has to pay for either the equipment and trainers or membships to gyms.
Permalink Reply by Robert Owens on April 19, 2009 at 8:53pm
If you can't do the job then get out male or female. We use the CPAT for my FD and I think its a great test. FIrefighters have to perform at athletic levels to complete our job. If you don't have the fitness level of an athlete then you shouldnt be doing the job.
Permalink Reply by Mike on April 19, 2009 at 11:25pm
It seems as if people like taking pop shots at people for their disscussions and as I said before these are issues that are being discussed around the fire and EMS field and I wanted to share the issues and get other opinions! Its funny that only 2 or 3 people have taken this discussion out of context and everyone else views it as what it is, a dissussion not an opinion! I could make some assumptions from the comments of the ones taking shots at me but you know what they say about those that assume! I suppose some would say have thicker skin, but I, like most, hate for people to take what I say and turn it for the negative! For this to be a brotherhood/sisterhood, we sure know how to show love!
Permalink Reply by Nikki Baggott on April 20, 2009 at 12:25am
I dont believe the CPAT or any test should be made easier for women or for anyone. Having equipment the fits a smaller person better for the test would be nice since I am given that on the job, I figure that would be a fair request, but otherwise I have not complaints. Honestly I wouldnt want to work beside anyone male or female that cant earn the job just like everyone else.
Permalink Reply by frank bresee on April 20, 2009 at 4:38am
i agree. my wife is a firfighter and she's the first female firefighter for the city she works in. it took her a couple of times to pass the cpat but when she failed it. she didnt talk about legal action. she worked out harder and prepaired herself to retake it. she then passed it and earned her position on the fire dept. and yes there were plenty of guys that failed the cpat also.
Permalink Reply by lutan1 on April 20, 2009 at 5:11am
I got an idea....

Let's reduce it so that the obese can join.

In fact, not just the obese, but the morbidly obese.

And let's retrofit our trucks once we've lowered the standard a bit more to allow for wheelchair bound members.

As tongue-in-cheek as this is intended, minimum standards are in place for a reason. Lowering them achieves nothing except potentially putting someone at risk, whether it's male or female, further down the track. Also remember that the lowering of the standard not only puts us at risk, but themselves and the community they're serving.
Permalink Reply by Cody W. Nelson on April 20, 2009 at 8:07am
It was actually developed so more women could pass it!
Permalink Reply by Jake Fireman on April 20, 2009 at 9:32am
lutan...loved that....blind firefighters??? Why not. Just make everything so it is in braile language. Afterall, we cant see anyway when were in a fire, they could use the sense of touch....OUCH! Too hot...better get out of here!

Derrek...good reply...You just have to want it bad enough!
Permalink Reply by Darrick Baker on April 20, 2009 at 2:14pm
The CPAT was designed to replicate the tasks that a firefighter is required to do on the job. The test has been validated by the IAFC and the IAFF, and is the industry standard physical ability test. I think "dumbing it down" would be an injustice. I hate to say it, but for the most part firefighting is a young man's job. That doesn't mean that women can't or shouldn't do the job, but changing the physical requirements is not he answer.
Permalink Reply by Mike Lintz on April 21, 2009 at 5:14am
I agree with you derrek if you want it bad enough you will pass it. I know departments that use the combat challenge and there was a big stink with that because if your shorter you have more difficulties with the hose raise or dummy drag. It doesn't matter short or tall, male or female, skinny or obese If you want the job train for the job and pass the test. Like everyone has said if you want it bad enough you will get it stop the bitching and moaning about it and train for it.
Permalink Reply by Julia Miller on April 22, 2009 at 1:28pm
Ladies, there is an old saying, "if you can't take the heat,get the heck out of the kitchen". I do not think that standards should be lessened for CPAT for females. '

Either you can do the job or you can't. One thing I can tell you is that if my son, once he goes through CPAT and passes and if he is in a situation in a fire where he needs to be pulled out and it is a female, she damn well better be able to pull her weight and his to get him out. Period. I think any wife, mother, father, etc., would feel the same way about their kid being in there. It isn't discrimination by any means. It is just you either pull your weight and there should be no difference in what is expected of you as to your male counterparts/partners. Either you both do the same or forget it. Lives depend upon it.

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