flash hoods

talking to some "old timers" no offense to anybody. my father in particular whom joind the fire department in 1972, well when he started the never had turnout gear what you left the house in was all you had with the eceptoin of ww2 gas mask as thier form of scba... he along with other folks claim that flash-hoods although they are a very safe and smart item to wear it alows the modern firefighter to get to far into the fire with out really fealing whats happening around them and causing to many brothers to get trapped in a flashover... my question is... are flash-hoods truly a false sense of sucurity so to speak or not? mind you everyone ive talked to once again my father in particular says don't be a fool wear your gear and i intend to i just figured ide start a discution and hear what others have to say

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Permalink Reply by Matthew Vogt on March 9, 2011 at 10:23pm
my opinion is that if there is a well trianed guy on the nob and he cools the ceiling like he is supposed to then a flash-over can be prevented. besides if the room is rolling good then you should'nt be to far if at all in the door of such room to begin the attack it all comes down to knowing what you got for fire load and knowing what your doing... just my opinion feel free to speak your mind thats why i created this forum.
Permalink Reply by FETC on March 9, 2011 at 10:34pm
Well no disrespect to your dad but today's fires are hotter, burn faster, and have an escalated flashover occurance compared to dad's CO driven fires with all natural furnishings.(CO driven flashovers occurred at 1100 F compared to Acrolein which is only one gas in today's smoke and it has a flashpoint down around 400F)

Your gear is rated depending on your specifications for about 500F for only 5 minutes (no direct flame contact) before it suffers total thermal insult saturation. (total saturation is at the point you feel the sting) Without a hood your ears would have melted 4 minutes before your shoulders would start to feel the "sun burn" sting.

Going back to the old days of 3/4 boots, long coats, and no hood in today's fires will only assure that you provide an exterior only fire department.

I tell many in the fire service, if you are unable to sense "the conditions" through the gear mandated in the NFPA standard, (flash hood) than your fire department has not afforded you with the proper training on Thermal Insult Recognition.

Certain traditions toward how we fight a fire will only work if you are facing the exact same fire from back in the day... Sorry some traditions do not overlap to today's fire.

http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/thermal-insult-recogn...
Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on March 9, 2011 at 10:41pm
It didn't make sense to use body parts as meat thermometers back in the day, and it makes even less sense to do that now.
Permalink Reply by Bull on March 10, 2011 at 12:19am
Do seatbelts give you false sense of security ??? I hope not, but like a fire...you still need to be aware of your surroundings, and drive defensivly...watching for what might jump out at you, like watching and reading the smoke, whats it telling you ??? Just my comparison !!!
Permalink Reply by Roy Walker on March 10, 2011 at 3:08am
I believe FETC said it all ,if you dont feel comfortable get the right training ASAP!!!!!!!!!
Permalink Reply by Shareef Abdu Nur on March 10, 2011 at 4:46am
FETC
Well said and I couldn't agree more.
Permalink Reply by capcityff on March 10, 2011 at 7:48am
We also have more/better training these days. Basic classes teach what to look for as far as flashover conditions. So if the fireman knows what he is doing then he should be fine.(unfortunately many don't have good training)

Being able to go in further also means more aggressive firefighting. I'm sure the number of structures saved these days are much higher than the past.
Permalink Reply by Matthew Vogt on March 10, 2011 at 3:19pm
its not that i dont feel comfortable because i feel fine doing the jobe i was just wondering what others felt on this topic
Permalink Reply by Matthew Vogt on March 10, 2011 at 3:21pm
i agree 100% thats why i wear all my gear i want to be able to fight the next one and not be dead or really messed up
Permalink Reply by Matthew Vogt on March 10, 2011 at 3:27pm
i also agree 100% traing has come a long way even at my age when i took ff1 in 06 quite a few things have been changed or added in todays ff1 as far as being aggressive i know what thats like becuase i belong to an agressive engine co. i may not get the number of fires as some (larger towns/cities) do but i get my fair share this forum was created to get peoples opinion on how they feel about todays ppe compared to the crank-start days thanks for always giving good feedback in my columns

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