Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Richard Embrey on August 9, 2011 at 8:40am

I find NFPA 921 is an essential tool for investigating the origin and cause of a fire. I refer to it frequently both on and off the fire scene and have found it very useful in preparing for court room testimony. Because I am strictly an origin and cause investigator, not all of the information in the 921 applies to what I do. NFPA 921 wasn't written just for origin and cause investigations. It encompasses the science of fire from basic fire behavior to more complex therories of fire science that would probably be useful to an forensic investigator. I beleive it serves my purposes well. I supplement the 921 with Kirk's Fire Investigation.

Permalink Reply by Brian Parmelee on August 17, 2011 at 5:55pm

NFPA 921 is a good tool to use. It is a guide not a standard but if you ever go to court and have not followed it you may have trouble winning the case. If you do deviate from it you will have to be able to explain why you deviate from it and back that up with another resource. It does not cover every aspect of fire investigations but it is being rewritten and expanded all of the time. Every investigator should read this book completely, understand it and utilize it on investigations when you get stuck during the investigation. Whether an investigator likes it or not is really not an option any more. Investigators are being held to this “guide” in court.

Permalink Reply by Dennis Reynolds on August 17, 2011 at 9:42pm

While I often struggle with some of the context of 921, I have to use it for what it is. A National Standard. A standard that we will be judged by in most courts. I have witnessed what can happen to an investigator that is not familiar with 921 when questioned by the defense. Not pleasant.

It does appear that some of the text seems unrealistic (refer to K-9 portion)and almost impossible at times. But it is the standard.

Being certified Fire and Crime Scene Investigator for nearly 10 years now, I have also found several other pieces of literature that are more helpful and easier to read and understand, one of them being Kirks. But there are several others.

With that being said, the only major problem I have with 921 is finding an accredited organization to provide updates to the standard. I have been searching for a class specific to 921 in my state (Missouri). It is more difficult than I anticipated. I now supervise the investigators in our organization and I have found increasing difficulty in obtaining one of these classes in a timely and economic manner. Any suggestions?

The state provides an IFSAC certification, but it is REALLY basic as I am sure you are aware. I have begun an apprenticeship program based on 921 and 1033 for our new investigators that takes nearly a year to complete. A credible course specific to 921 would better prepare them.

Just my $.02
D

Permalink Reply by Keith Ebel on August 19, 2011 at 11:27am

Dennis, check the IAAI website. They offer classes on 921 and have a new course for 1033...
One of the issues I have is...if we had a room full of season investigators and the TV we were watching caught fire.....we would have to rule it as undetermined per 921...because we can not determine the first material ignited. Now me as a home owner, I have a difficult time having an undetermined in my file...say 50/50 it could have also been intentionally set.

Permalink Reply by Jeff Allen on October 27, 2011 at 3:13pm

First of all I like the quote that 'the science of fire investigation cannot be contained all in one publication'.  And NFPA 921 is just one publication, with flaws I might add.  And although some courts have stated that NFPA 921 is a 'standard' it remains a guide, and only a guide.  The technical committee people I've talked to make it clear that it never will be a standard because standards are written in such a way that you can adopt them into law, and they never want 921 adopted into law.  With that said I agree that we in this business need to be very familiar with its content.  In criminal cases in my state you are challenged more on 1033 (which is a standard) than you are on 921.  Kirks is another good book for reference but it too is not a perfect publication.  And there are others.