Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve Pechie on December 26, 2010 at 6:48pm

Barry, this kinda stuff happens all over. My wife and I aren't "in the Brotherhood" either. We show up to help our neighbors and a lot of other members show up for the power trip or the measly check we get every 6 months. Those who want the money and/or the power pushed out the people who are there to help their neighbors. So we bide our time, keep ourselves current in membership and wait for them to flush themselves out, then go back and do the good thing again. Welcome to the boat.

Permalink Reply by Al "Top" Styles on December 26, 2010 at 9:47pm

Barry,

I’m kind of confused by your post, you say that people who get F^% over, are told by guys they are not part of the brotherhood. Maybe I read the post wrong, but the word BROTHERHOOD in the fire service is worldwide, no matter who, where or what. Anybody in the fire service is your Brother.

The definition of Brotherhood (per Webster’s Dictionary): the QUALITY or state of being brothers 2: FELLOWSHIP, ALLIANCE 3: an association (as a labor union or monastic society) for a particular purpose 4: the whole body of persons engaged in a BUSINESS or profession.

The Fire Service was founded on brotherhood, we must continue to understand it, teach it and live it. It is our cornerstone. If you have members who do not believe or understand it, you must educate them. Go to the F.O.O.L.S website, they are all about the brotherhood. Read “Pride and Ownership” by Chief Rick Lasky. Both are all about brotherhood.

If people want to quit cuz they didn’t get things their way, than they need to ask themselves why they are there in the first place. If this is over a “gift card” than again they really need to ask themselves “why am I here?” Because this job is about helping Mr. & Mrs. Smith (our customers) it’s not about us.
If I have misread your post, than I apologize, if I am correct please contact me and I would be happy to help you through this.

Top
EGH-KTF-DTRT

Permalink Reply by dano martinez on December 29, 2010 at 10:03pm

I agree w/ Mr. Styles. We're all Bro's (& Sis's) in the figuritive sense. Sometimes though it may seem more like a disfunctional family (w/in each individual firehouse) and there will sometimes be annimosity between depatrments for any number of reasons, but when it comes down to the nitty-gritty (fighting fires & saving people), all of these petty BULLSH!T ideas are put aside and we get the job done together, hand-in-hand (so to speak). Be your own person and do what you think is right, not the person you think others will like (by being a blind follower). Treat your fellow fire fighters with respect and don't get caught up in the "click" or the rumor mill. These things sow seeds of contention that can be detrimental in our business. We need to trust that everyone on a scene has our backside covered. If you don't feel safe "going in" w/ someone, because they are wreckless, let the officers know this. Usually the problems weed themselves out. Sometimes though, not as quickly as we would like. Stay safe!
- dano

Permalink Reply by Pararescue on December 31, 2010 at 2:55am

What these guys are trash talkin is politics in the fire house. It's like "You broke my GI Joe when we were kids and I'm still pissed games." To be a Brother is to be dedicated to the cause, the area you serve, but most of all.... Be able and willing to kill one of your Brothers in a heated argument over the last cut job, and tones drop and you both get on the same rig and work together as a team. And know in your head that "Yea, I'd die to save him. And he'd do the same for me." You dont have to see eye to eye with a Brother, you might show him or her something they never knew before. And the same might happen to you. It's all about unspoken love. You have to love someone at least a little if you'd risk your life with or for them.

And the jack wagons that think just because they are part of a click makes them brothers? Well I've seen more than my fair share stabbed in the back and leave the clique and never look back. Check this out and other Rescue 2 FDNY video's, you'll get the meaning of the Brotherhood. Not this clique / political BS these yahoo's call brotherhood.

Permalink Reply by Barry Copley on January 1, 2011 at 11:38am

I understand the term Brotherhood..What I meant was..One of our members wasn't happy for whatever reason he felt he got screwed over.Well he told me and a few other guys that he was going to quit that we should too because we were a brotherhood that if they screwed one of us(Being Him) that we all should quit.I don't feel I should quit because he does know what I mean?I'm not in it for the money because we don't get paid of course.I'm not in it for the power either cause really I have no authority or power.I just want to help people.Ever since I was a kid I wanted to be a firemen.

Permalink Reply by Al "Top" Styles on January 1, 2011 at 8:39pm

Barry,

I get what you mean now….Sorry for the confusion…can show my post to your friend than maybe he will understand true brotherhood. In my 20+ years I’ve seen “guys getting screwed”….NOT…..What I mean is there are always 2 sides to a story, we usually only hear one side, hence “the screwing”. If your “brother” asks you to quit over something that effects only him, than that is a choice not a brotherhood issue…..If there is an issue with management (which I understand) than maybe “banding together” to show support is ok ( but watch what battles you pick). So to put it bluntly, if you love what you do and this is a personal conflict that the individual is having…..DON’T QUIT FOR HIM. Do the right thing for those we protect and keep doing it for yourself. Good luck and stay strong
TOP
EGH-DTRT

Permalink Reply by Barry Copley on January 3, 2011 at 6:23pm

Thanks for the feedback I will definitely take that in mind.I wasn't planning on quitting any way just because of the fact he was.I have no intentions of quitting.I was just wondering if I was wrong not to support his cause or not.Some things have been changing around the station I don't know if its going to be for better or for worse.I guess only time will tell.We had a chief quit and another guy is in the running for it and just my personal opinion if he does in fact get it then we're screwed.I don't plan on voting for him.
Let me explain my just cause though.We had a fire about a week and a couple days ago.Me and a crew of men were at the station in full gear had the bay doors open the truck started and everything.Well where we are volunteers nobody showed up to drive us and none of us at the station were on the driving list.Well I had somebody call our "SOON TO BE CHIEF" to see if he'd drive us.This was at 7:30 PM now and he does work day shift but damnit it was only 7:30.Well any way he started cussing GD IT my job is more important than that fire he said.Now I remind you it was early and my opinion is if he's planning on becoming chief that no matter what time of day or night it is if he's at home and we have a fire he needs to Roll Out.Do you agree?

Permalink Reply by Al "Top" Styles on January 7, 2011 at 5:29pm

Barry,
You have begun to “open the can”. Let me take some time and cover everything you talk about. Please understand, what I post here is my opinion, so take it for what it is worth, I live and work in the Midwest, so things are different, my department might be structured different, etc. But here goes,

First off, glad to hear that you will “stick it out”. You MUST DO what is right for YOU!!!. Now on to the meat and potatoes of your post. You possibly have an administration that is “voted in” by the ff’s. This can be “bad” or “good”. If you like the person now, than good, if you vote him in and he “changes” than bad……That is the dilemma with the “voting system”. I am a Fire Chief (Fulltime), I went through a hiring process and was interviewed 3 different times, by different people, I was “voted” on by the township board, not the members. Now like I said earlier, I come from a different area and our departments might not be similar. So understand I am not saying that the department “voting” style doesn’t work, but it can come down to “who likes who” at the time.

As for the whole response issue, as the AHJ (authority having jurisdiction) the Fire Chief or his/her designee is required to make sure that fire protection is given, now with you “guys” not being able to drive poses an operational issue, the Chief must make sure that apparatus responds to alarms (calls), so it is ultimately HIS responsibility to those you protect EVEN IF HE IS NOT THERE. That’s right, even if the Chief is not on the call and something goes wrong he/she can be held accountable (that’s cam be tough for some to swallow). Now we can not speculate why he did not respond (that only causes more problems). We can however reiterate that we have a job to protect those we serve and sometimes we all forget that.

Please keep an open mind and remember that whether or not he gets the “job” you need to do what’s right for you. I can tell you that I became the Chief of my department and it was in a completely different state, so they were just as “nervous” about me coming as I was to going, but with open, clear and honest communication we are working great. I know that is long winded, but I want you to see that this is nothing new to the fire service; it’s just new to us.

If you need to talk or have other questions please do not hesitate to contact me at dtfdars1@mcd911.net and I will be happy to talk with you more and try and help you through this transition. Good luck and stay safe brother.

“Top” Styles
EGH-DTRT

Permalink Reply by david sullivan on January 8, 2011 at 10:12am

i myself stand strong with my brotherhood i would die for my brothers not only in my hall but in any hall we all are brothers but at the same time we are here to save life an property to never leave a man behind an everyone goes home with out the brotherhood we would be standing alone

Permalink Reply by Michael Moralez on January 24, 2011 at 3:26pm

I guess it would be like every family not every one is goin to get along and there are going to be people wanting you to side with them. My advice dont side with nobody do what makes you happy

Permalink Reply by Michael Moralez on January 24, 2011 at 3:30pm

I know what you mean steve only our department dont get paid we get water credits towards our water bill and we only get the member numbers when there is a big fire but only to look pretty when its time to overhaul and mop up roll hose and all that you look around its the same 5 or 6 out of about 15 or 20 that are there doin the dirty work making meetings and takein care of our stations if there is a brother hood around here its our 5 or 6 that i know will be at the next call

Permalink Reply by Jared Michael Snyder on January 26, 2011 at 12:02pm

I feel pretty fortunate that my department here in southeast Utah is not like some of these others... We dont have any members who are on power trips or feel "holier than thou." We are a close knit community here and it shows in the integrity and camaraderie of our fire department. We all train together once a week, and see each other on a daily basis. Its hard not to run into each other on the streets, in the grocery store, at the post office, in a town of 4-5000 people year round. We have an excellent officer corps and a great team of dedicated individuals. Our chief is a great leader and does not stand for the alienation of crew members... I have been with my department for over a year now, and in my years of experience, this has been the best department I have served for... I'm proud to be a member of my department and i cant say enough about the fire service as a whole.

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