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IAFF Condemns Tennessee House Fire Policy
TODD FAULKNER
WPSD
Reprinted with Permission
PADUCAH - A local fire department's decision to let a home burn is attracting national attention and sparking national debate.
A firefighters group is lashing out against members of their own. The International Association of Fire Fighters is condemning the South Fulton Fire Department for their actions last week.
Fire crews refused to put out a house fire in Obion County, Tennessee, because the owner did not pay the $75 coverage fee. The Association's general president released a statement Tuesday on the city's policy of subscription fire service.
The IAFF statement reads, in part, "We condemn South Fulton's ill-advised, unsafe policy. Professional, career fire fighters shouldn't be forced to check a list before running out the door to see which homeowners have paid up. They get in their trucks and go."
The statement also reads, "Because of South Fulton's pay-to-play policy, fire fighters were ordered to stand and watch a family lose its home."
Todd Cranick, son of Gene Cranick, tells Local 6 that his parents have received several thousand dollars from the insurance company to cover immediate costs. Cranick went on to say that the insurance plans on covering all damage and property losses. Right now, there is no fund set up to help the Cranick family.
The IAFF is headquartered in Washington, D.C., representing nearly 300,000 full-time professional firefighters and paramedics.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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Herb, your first statement is is completely dishonest. "I guess I didn't want to believe that YOU, or any other chief would subject his crew to being filmed in front of a burning home while the homeowner pleaded for help...all because the idiot took a chance for $75. But alas....you are THAT guy."
I am NOT "that guy". I've never done that and I never will. Being able to understand something in a situation that I'll never be in doesn't make me the bad guy anywhere outside your cranial cavity.
Your baseless assumptions are YOUR problem, Herb, not mine.
Your comment about "feels bad" is a false assumption, and I've already explained that to you.
I don't know you at all, but I know that you don't have any credibility based on:
1) Your dishonest statement above.
2) Your constant use of logical fallacies in this discussion.
3) Your constant ducking of direct questions on the matter.
4) Your arrogance in insisting that everyone do it YOUR way. That's not "strong feelings, it's arrogance.
5) Your false assumption that the problem was the fire department.
6) Your false assumptions that because YOU feel bad about the situation that the fire department, the fire chief, or the city did something wrong.
7) Your appalling refusal to consider the economic realities that Obion County faces.
8) Your insistance that I can't make an informed decision on your credibility because I don't know you. That's another false assumption. Look at #1 through #7 for the evidence about why you have no credibility on the subject.
Herb, this isn't the second time you've told me that you won't respond to me any more. It's at least the third. That doesn't exactly scream "credibility" to anyone who reads your statements here.
And Herb, you closed with yet another logical fallacy - yet ANOTHER Straw Man.
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Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
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There's no rule that says doing the right thing or following a public policy will always look good. That doesn't make it wrong.
I'm thinking TRIAGE. Imagine the public moral outrage to learn that at an MCI some of the victims will actually NOT BE TREATED because their odds of survival are low enough to not warrant the effort to save them, when many others with less effort CAN be saved. Now THERE's a moral conundrum.
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Bullseye!
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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Hey; I used do-not-resusitate as an example of a moral conundrum in one of these threads. Hell, I can't remember which one.
But, I would guess the "moralists" would violate a DNR because, morally, they can't let someone just die.
My mom had a DNR. It was followed.
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Sorry Art,
DNR is a person's or family's wish, not the same thing as triage. But keep at it, you'll get it right. ;)
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Permalink Reply by Herb Genelly III on
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Well.......a DNR is something very different........ because, as you've put it, it involves a human life.........so it's treated very differently. If there was someone in the home during this incident, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
A DNR requires everyone to be on the same page (Doctor, Family, Patient), and have executed a desire to die peacefully. (BTW, in cases where there is ANY question about the validity of the DNR, you have to error on the side of the patient, with IMPLIED CONSENT at the core of the procedures that must be followed).
The homeowner didn't have a singed agreement that said Don't put out my Fire...LOL
I had that very situation happen regarding the DNR, and we saved the patient giving him several weeks more. The DNR was not provided to us on arrival, and it was a family member who called 911.
Are you saying that was wrong?
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He didn't have a signed agreement saying PUT OUT THE FIRE either (LOL). His offering to pay is a little like someone changing their mind once they've jumped off the bridge. It's understandable but kind of late in the fall to be changing your mind.
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Now, dammit; why can't I come up with what I thought was a very good "what if"?
So, you are summarily dismissing it?
I'll be back. Check out my links in No Pay; No Play. Just posted them. Excellent.
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You're right. I closed the post because, in retrospect, I realized that my energy is better served in an open and respectful dialog with folks like yourself. That 26 minute video of the chief of the neighboring town was really informative. I see the pain on his face when he talks about the possibility of having to employ a subscription service in his area.
And the fact that he's worked on a plan for 4 years, only to have politicians throw it right back to him is a shame. Also, hearing that the neighbor was willing to pay thousands of dollars to pay for the expense of suppression.........wow.
I really hope they (the community) gets that fixed. I was part of an organized movement that removed the entire sitting board of directors in our district due to the politicization and polarization of our department. It was only the second time in CA history that an entire governing body was removed from office. It was only possible due to the community wanting change. Thank God we didn't have the internet as developed as it is now, back then.........LOL (My fingers would have been bleeding)
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Permalink Reply by Julia Miller on
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Would they have sat there if someone had been trapped inside? I lived in a town with a volunteer EMS and fire department in NJ for most of my life. When the bell/whistle blew or went off they responded. The township gave each department $35K per year and we also had a yearly fund drive. Why couldn't South Fulton bill the people say $125 instead of the $75 and then just put out the fire. As it is there were two dogs and a cat that died. What if it had been two kids? I would hope the response would have been different but from the statements that are coming out of this town it doesn't appear that way. Look, I guess I am old school. When you call the fire department came. Out here in LA they do. You call, they come. Now the LAPD is a different thing. That one you can be on your own. My husband knows because they had a personal truck hit their building one night when he was working and when I went there about 45 minutes after the accident happened a black and white drove by with both of us frantically waving him in, and he looked, waved and kept on going. It wasn't until 3 hours later that a black and white unit showed up. My husband is also diabetic but thankfully he keeps some food in his office if he is late or there is an emergency and he can't leave. I just think the fire department here could have put out the fire and charged the people later and it would have certainly been better press then they are getting know, plus their chief would I assume be less sore in the jaw after being hit (which was wrong) by the person's son. I just hope their decision making would have been different had their been someone trapped inside.
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Permalink Reply by Eric Henderson on
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Fine, so Obion county isn't acting as an intermediary between their residents and South Fulton. How does that make any difference at all?
The fact is Obion county isn't providing any fire protection, and South Fulton is trying to fill the gap with the subscription service. They could pull out entirely and leave the entire area unprotected, so that there wouldn't be any more list to check, but that seems like a bad idea to me.
What south fulton is doing is GREAT. They are doing exactly what they should be doing and more, and they should be commended for it. The people who should be blamed for this incident are people like the homeowner who didn't pay the fee and who decided they didn't need fire protection (or at least, that they didn't need to pay for fire protection, and figured the fire department would protect them anyway)
Obion county NEEDS to mandate fire protection for all homes to prevent any further tragedies like the one that happened to this family.
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I thought it was especially appropriate that a member of the Cranick family was there, stating that they don't condone the threats or physical harm to firefighters.
We did the same thing here Herb.
Board wouldn't work in the best interests of the district or their firefighters, so they were bounced.
When it gets down to the question: would you rather lose trustees or firefighters, the answer becomes very clear.
And though I am now a trustee?
I STILL feel that way.
If I am not getting it done for my district and our firefighters, then I need to go.
By the way, I was just re-elected to a new 6 year term.
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