Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Fire Critic on May 11, 2010 at 11:59pm

I agree, small cracks that don't seem to be a huge issue. However, that is me going on these pictures so I cannot be certain.

Here is the thing with traditional helmets. The part that matters is the part that goes on your head. It is intended to protect your head.

The brim is intended to shed water so it doesn't go in your coat. It may protect some, but that isn't the main purpose of the brim.

I agree with the comments about buying something new, then you know the history.

I have a N6A helmet that has some wear on it by now. The brim has some cracking that is expected over the years. I will replace it in the future with a brand new leather. I also have a fairly new paul conway leather and well worn paul conway composite to use if need be.

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on May 12, 2010 at 12:43am

The employer must pay workers comp benefits for employees injured on the job, regardless of what safety equipment the employee was wearing - or not.

Lawyers can't change that fact - it's the law.

Permalink Reply by Paul Montpetit on May 12, 2010 at 6:28am

that's true...but what protects the Department and untimately the community from law suits....? I am John Q Fireperson....I am working a fire.....I get hurt....I call 1-800-scumbag and get a lawyer.....He investigates and notes some of my gear is NOT approved for use for structural firefighting/ or it no longer meets the standards.....Now who is going to found liable by the courts....? And who is going to pay the damages....? and who will pay the punitive award....? If you are in a Volunteer Company this will probably be picked up by your Village/City.....and may very well close your doors.......this is what I am getting to......

Permalink Reply by John Sees on May 12, 2010 at 9:32am

When I visited Cairns they said that they do repair leather helmets. Give them a call.
Good luck, be safe and remember once you start using your leather you can also say "I don't wear tubberware".

Permalink Reply by Brian Roupp on May 12, 2010 at 11:53am

those aint just paint cracks... its O.O.S

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on May 15, 2010 at 11:13pm

NOT approved for structural firefighting by whom?

No longer meets the standards, but is in good repair and meets the standards at the time it was manufactured are two very different things.

Meets OSHA (the legal standard) and NFPA (guidelines) are two very different things.

Anyone can sue for any reason at any time. Unless the suit if found to be frivolous, each party is generally on the hook for their side's legal expenses. Even if all of the gear met every standard in force on the day the LOD injury occurred, it's probably less expensive to settle. Having older gear or an OSHA-approved helmet vs. a NFPA-approved helmet isn't going to make much - if any - difference.

Remember, the four things necessary to prove negligence in court are duty, standard of care, proximate cause, and injury. Even if an injury occurs, the department would have to be shown to have a duty to keep firefighters from using personal gear (doubtful if the policy allows it), proximate cause (the department didn't cause the injury, the fire did), and that the standard of care is NFPA instead of OSHA (difficult to prove to a jury's satisfaction).

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on May 15, 2010 at 11:16pm

When a building falls on your head, it doesn't matter what kind of helmet you're wearing, you're going to suffer serious consequences. Even if a review board found against the injured firefighter, that kind of ruling doesn't generally survive judicial review, even at the administrative law review level.

Permalink Reply by Richard Armstrong on May 16, 2010 at 11:27am

Now this is a case where I 100% agree with you Jack.A person should not ask in here if the cracks in his helmet are still safe to the wearer.Not even if someone on FFN that is certified in this area should make that analysis by a few pics.Maybe the question should be does anyone have some names and phone #'s of people who certify buckets.That is the question he needs to ask.

Mac I would hope that you will not use the bucket until you have it properly certified by a qualified person.I know you probably paid good money and want to get it on but if the cracks have comprimised the integrity of the helmet and you just pretty it up with epoxies or bondo and slap some paint on it thinkin your good to go then you may be puttin your life at risk.Be safe and get it looked at!!!!!

Atleast for your families sake if not yours.

Permalink Reply by Jonathan Ingle on May 16, 2010 at 12:44pm

I have a N5A that did the same thing, if you take the paint off the cracks go away. The paint does that when it takes heat. Take and rub some of the paint off in that area and see if the cracks go away. If it does the best thing to do is find a leather worker and have them bring it down to bare leather and dye it black.

Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on May 17, 2010 at 10:21am

I hate to burst all of your bubbles.... The leather is basically a cosmetic cover. The real protection is in the interior bump cap. For those of you who use the older helmets with no liner, then you are on your own. If the exterior leather has a crack in it, it is still useable. Fix and paint it. If you get cracks in your composite helmet, that is the protection material. Big difference.

Permalink Reply by Richard Armstrong on May 17, 2010 at 10:47am

Well Jason what were saying is noone can judge wether or not it's just the leather that is cracked from a picture here.It needs to be looked at by a certified person.Like you stated yourself the leather is a cosmetic "cover".What is going on under the cover is what needs to be found out.If the leather dried and cracked by all means bondo it uo and get er done but if the cracks are from a bump on the haed and cracked it then it needs to be checked and buying it off of E-bay he wasn't told about the history I assume so it needs to be checked for his safety!!

Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on May 17, 2010 at 4:23pm

I agree with what you are saying about the ebay part. This is tantamount to buying a used car from a rental place. Who knows how they were driven? So, why is the helmet on ebay if there is nothing wrong with it. That is the best point!

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