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Officers Fired; Chief Resigns.
I recently wrote a blog about a story on the Dekalb County Georgia Fire Department.
It can be read here: http://www.firefighternation.com/profiles/blogs/didnt-you-didnt-you...
It is my opinion that the firings were justified. Not only that, but I believe that the Fire Commission should go on the public record as firing the chief as well. He resigned because he failed at his duty. In other words; he resigned before he could be fired in my opinion.
But don't take it on my word. Read the official report to frame your comments. I have included the links to other related stories.
Report here: http://www.cbsatlanta.com/download/2010/0128/22368624.pdf
News article here: http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/georgia-fire-official...
Chief resigns here: http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/georgia-chief-resigns...
More fallout here: http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/captain-fired-in-georgia-fire
Family asks for apology here: http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/georgia-family-wants-...
And for the record, I am not piling on or kicking a department when it's down. This is another incident where we can all learn. There have been several articles and blogs written about it.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Tom Wheland on
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It totally blows my mind that any firefighter could do something like that to begin with.
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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Tom:
And that there are people out there offering a litany of excuses also blows the mind.
Citizen reports that she has a fire.
Fire department is dispatched.
Fire department does a "drive by" investigation and makes no contact with citizen.
Five hours later, said citizen is dead from the fire that she had reported five hours earlier.
Open and shut.
Family of deceased has retained attorney. And I'm afraid that layoffs will pay for the settlement.
My heart goes out to the good men and women of this fire department, because I know that there are.
But they need to ferret out those who have literally destroyed their public's trust.
This isn't the time for excuses.
It's time to fix a broken process so that something like this never happens again.
We all makes mistakes. That doesn't mean that we have to repeat them.
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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What excuses Art?
If you are referring to my "devil's advocate" approach and asking other questions and clarification of info as an "excuse" then you are wrong. I am asking those questions because some information was not readily known and going off of info as reported by these articles. I wanted to bring up other discussion points and possibilities before just willy nilly accepting the news story. I never made excuses, just questioned some things because info was not available.
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Permalink Reply by Oldman on
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When this story first broke, I initially thought that the whole story hasn't come out, and that surely this didn't occur as is being reported. But it appears that it was just as exactly as reported.
I am one to play "devils advocate" on most any subject, and have on many discussions on this site. But I simply cannot on this story. I really tried to find some justification in the actions, (or lack of) in this tragic event. There is none. This is way beyond complacency, or laziness. This was the classic definition of negligence. There was a duty to act. There was a failure to act, and the failure to act caused the death of the occupant.
Piling on or kicking that department when it's down? I think not.
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John:
First of all, anyone on my friend's list will get the respect from me in that, if I have an opposing opinion, I will pin their name to my response.
You took the comment personally and you shouldn't have and I will leave it at that. I post my blogs on FOUR websites and links also go out on Facebook and Twitter. Do you honestly think that I was singling you out?
I play "devil's advocate" once in awhile as well. But I usually say that I am doing it.
As I said in this thread; I am looking for diverse viewpoints. Feel free to express them.
So, please discuss.
TCSS.
Art
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Art, I was simply asking as to what excuses and yes I did take some of this personally because my questioning etc differed from others on the links provided. I would rather know all facts in something before basing a decision and why I asked some questions. The articles themselves seemed slighted towards the incident, but didn't address reasons as to why guys may not get off trucks etc, like standing by a hydrant. Reading the report as posted I can see the issue at hand here and does answer some questions I posed.
In that report it mentions that one officer didn't hit the ON SCENE button on the MDT.....in one of the articles, they made that sound like it was a fireable offense. I disagree with THAT because we also have MDT's and one can hit a button but it does not always register or can take awhile. Another issue I have brought up is that an officer of a rig standing by a hydrant should not be babysitting the first in officer, nor should they take command, especially without a good view. Reading the report, even that officer drove by the house to turn around, so I can understand the reasonings.
I was more curious as to what you were regarding as excuses vs plausible explanations.
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Here is the latest on this.
Two "firefighters" want their jobs back, but listen to the video.
Also, you will notice CHIN HAIR on Captain Greene. Would that be a problem in your opinion?
And the excuse that "if they had known that the homeowner placed the call, they would have made contact with her" just doesn't fly in my book.
I think the public statement is more damning that if they had remained silent.
Check it out: http://www.cbsatlanta.com/video/22525240/index.html
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Permalink Reply by Reg Mathis on
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In following this incident, I must say that I am saddened, but not suprised. If you go out and do some research, you will find that the Dekalb County government has been involved in more scandels than Washington DC. The have a long history of government malfeasance and corruption.
Believe me, it trickles down...
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Hey John,
One of the first "excuses" that came out was the parties involved blaming dispatch for not giving them the proper information. And I don't think that hitting the On Scene button on the MDT is a valid replacement for a 360 of the reporting address.
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"I wasn't sure if I was at the right location",
Lets see, this house is number ... and that house is number ... The law of averages would dictate that would be the correct house. Get out of the truck, go to the door, knock, knock, knock, Fire Department! I would be willing to bet that if it wasn't the right address, the occupant would let them know. At least looking at the dwelling one might see sooted windows or maybe a faint glow.
Then again, maybe they were absent the day they taught fire in fire school. Maybe they didn't pay attention during building construction class, something about making tighter, better insulated, energy efficient houses.
Sorry, I just can't get there from here.
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And I don't think that hitting the On Scene button on the MDT is a valid replacement for a 360 of the reporting address.
I was referring to one of the reasons for one of the second due officers also being terminated and they said it was because he failed to hit the On Scene button on his MDT. Nothing about a 360 and failing to hit the On Scene button is a very stupid reason for a termination because the damn things don't always register. We have them and there have been several times you hit On Scene and it doesn't register.
Dispatch can be an issue at times, but it is also the responsibilty of the officer to ask for more information such as a call back number etc. However, some things should probably have been relayed, but reality is that many dispatchers today don't have the experience and knowledge like a dispatcher who is a part of a dept would. Although, if the city is bent on pinning responsibility onto anyone and everyone involved in this case, maybe dispatch should also be looked at.
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