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Juniors-only Section
I have been watching some of the postings on here by the less than literate junior members lately. I have also seen some of the "I want to be a firefighter types" post some ridiculous things on here. These discussions inevitably turn into the "learn to spell" or "shut-up and learn" conversations. I am not saying I have not participated in them either. But, is there some way to limit the posting capabilities of members? What if the junior members were only able to post in the junior area? Or, what if they were not allowed on here at all? I am sure that they can figure out a way to get around any sort of age requirement for membership, they are a little smarter than that. But, if they start posting immature crap, turn off their capability to post at all. They can still learn an awful lot with a read-only account.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mike Schlags (Captain Busy) Retd on
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Whoa... that's a bold statement Art... again, do some research on how the human body develops to help support your attempt to change state laws.
Missing Text: The pre-frontal cortex, which handles reasoning, grows during the pre-teen years. But it is pruned back during adolescence, increasing impulsive, risk-taking behavior.
At age 18, the brain finishes developing the part of the brain that tells them when things are safe or dangerous (cognitive reasoning centers).
Humans younger than 17-18, dependent upon whether it is a man or woman involved, noting that women's brains develop much earlier than males. The adolescent brain is still growing. This region is responsible for things such as impulse control and moral judgment and is the last to mature, sometime in the early 20s, said Dr. Jordan Grafman of the NIH's National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke.
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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CBz:
I wouldn't even think about getting a law changed without doing the research.
Most of the time, I won't even post a blog without doing the requisite research.
But, I don't have to tell you. You have done your fair share of research.
That's one thing the old timers have managed to do over the years; compiled quite a library. But, my library isn't on shelves. It's in several jumbo totes. Finding it takes more time than researching it!
TCSS.
Art
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This was posted on Statter911 this morning: http://statter911.com/2010/01/02/investigation-under-way-into-why-1...
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Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
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It isn't the questions that interest me but the answers. How the hell could they...?
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So once again, why are children allowed on the fire scene? As if don't we have enough to worry about? This is more supporting information for you to work toward having kids under the age of 18 not be put in harms way... what a concept. Key point here is risk vs. benefit...
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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And it is the crap like this that plants the little idea in the minds of explorers and jrs that they also should be utilized as firefighters.
I agree Jack, I'm interested in the answers as well, how do you explain that, especially if said explorer is affiliated with the BSA or Learning for Life, at least they have a clear set of rules of what is and isn't allowed.
Now I believe in such programs and see them as a great way to familiarize youth with what the job does entail (ie, not all hero and glory as portrayed by Hollywood). I think they give a good taste of what the job asks and if it is something that a kid may like to pursue. I myself wanted to be a FF that I pursued the career from early on, whereas some of my explorer counterparts took a different direction, but many are FF's today. And we did it without going in, without doing burns, without driving apparatus, without doing wildland, without responding in POV, or leaving school.
There are just too many in a rush to do the job and not enough adults to actually say NO and to have the kids not be involved. I swear some of these adults allowing this crap are nothing but glorified explorers themselves thinking these fires are nothing more than a bonfire at scout camp. For crying out loud a kid misses a fire ....so freaking what....it isn't like they can't learn tactics in an academy. Using them in an interior attack??? Yeah I would want to know the answers for that.
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The attitude is almost cult-like, get them now while they're young otherwise they won't ever join later on in life. Bull shit.
With proper oversight and guidance it can be a great program but to assume that it is essential to have a junior program and that they then have to be given as much experience as possible or else they'll lose interest is nonsense. I think in allowing juniors to 'do as much as possible' is often times serving the adult's desires as it is the juniors.
"...adults allowing this crap are nothing but glorified explorers themselves..."
Exactly.
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Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on
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One of the comments made in this article also references that they allow the explorers in to mop up. This is completely unacceptable as well. The act of mopping up can still put one in an IDLH environment, expose them to toxic gases, have a structural collapse, etc. The explorers have no business participating in much more than shagging hoses outside or helping with rehad. Even the act of filling SBCA cylinders can becoe dangerous. How is it that any of these departments or Chiefs think they can act outside of child labor laws in the first place?
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Permalink Reply by Doug on
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I have a feeling that with all of these high profile incidents lately that this is all going to come to a head, in a federal courtroom, sometime in the near future.
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Permalink Reply by Troy Hieb on
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As a junior and now an active member of my fire department, I too have become aggrivated and taken part in these "learn how to spell" "shut up" conversations. I do agree that there is no point for these type of discussions, but I don't believe that the juniors should be seperated. Without the firemen and juniors interacting with eachother, how will they learn and get their questions answered. Having them both interact together is the best way to get the best answers. As far as controlling these posts, I am at a loss as to how to do it. It may just be something that we have to live with.
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Permalink Reply by Paul Montpetit on
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Troy the "shut-up" comes from days of being a probie....you learned to #1...show-up #2....Keep up and #3... Shut-up....its nothing new directed at the "New" Jrs here...the Old school believed that you couldn't learn if you were running at the mouth kind of holds a degree of truth if you think about it...Also please keep in mind that just 1 off comment by one member of a goup can and does label everyone in that group....thus, if one person makes a smartass remark or comment then the whole group is labeled as loser....Questions are fine, BUT think before you post it....The discussions on helmet colors, the color of FireTrucks, and the like are both boring and demeaning to the person that is here trying to learn or to share experiences...thats how one learns...through experiences....Hang in there...stay safe..........Paul
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Permalink Reply by Ben "Batman" Barry on
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Incidents like this are goig to affect explorers across the nation. Pretty soon we will not be allowed to do anything.
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