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Accountability
Is it me? or are Administrations been brain washed by "Accountability Gimmicks"? Latest and greatest PASS devices that signal temperature and identifies names and users on a box. Tens of thousands of dollars spent. For what? How about company officers identify who they are working with, communicate that to one person who is using a high tech pencil and paper. Fire companies need to use discipline and complete their assignments then return to manpower area. Each officer checks in and out of IDLH identifying their location and work assignment. Stop the madness of buying into gimmicks and start holding company officers responsible, but be consistent. And Firefighters need to be just as disciplined and not freelance. As much as you think it has gone away, it is just being cleverly disguised.
Let me know what you think.
Ken
Let me know what you think.
Ken
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Kevin Dunbar on
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I agree with you 100% just another thing to add to the cost of doing buisness. I am all for strict fire ground accountability, but this comes off to me as something for someone to make a lot of money on!
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Permalink Reply by Kimberly A Bownas on
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Accountability is really important and the freelancing has got to stop. There are some things new out there that are just what they are new and away to get fire departments to spend money that they don't need to spend. It all boils down to training using accountability and making everyone responsible for their actions, that includes officers as well. Accountability should be used at all calls period....
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Permalink Reply by Spanner 122 on
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Hmm, not sure how I feel about this one. Working in a warehouse or large open office floor, dark, smoke, fire, and you get separated from your crew... for whatever reason. You get disoriented and not sure where you are and because your department isn't "buying into" a radio for every man, you can't tell anyone where you think you might be (or you lose consciousness for any reason). This "gimmick" would pick you up and RIT could get you out. Just a thought. Shit happens, and disciplined or not, you can't always stop it or predict it. I don't mind Big Brother knowing where I am in a hothouse. I do, although, agree that sticking with basic accountability set ups in case of malfunction will always be necessary.
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Permalink Reply by Tony P on
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I think the gadget just passes data about temperature and air back to the computer - I don't think it can tell where you are in a building? GPS isn't accurate enough, and doesn't work well inside anyway. Triangulation from a phone signal? Slow if using a commercial network (or two).
We don't have individual radios to carry. We don't have heads-up displays. We rely on staying with our partner, on keeping an eye on our air guage - if the low air warning sounds then you haven't been watching, you should be outside already. People going inside should pass through the BA Control. People coming out should pass through BA control. BA control should be keeping watch on how long each team has been inside, ready to call them out if it's thought their air will be getting low. All these things can be done simply, accurately and cheaply. Training, practise and accountability. And accountability starts with the individual.
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Permalink Reply by Ken on
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I am not opposed to big brother watching, as for RIT and getting to you fast? not so much. Firefighters need to be trained to activate their PASS if they are lost and locate a safe area. If you lost and disoriented then no RIT team can just enter the building and find you. That is why command and or manpower has your assignment written down. Good response though
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Great insight. Training, Training, Training. We as firefighters should be planning our work so our low air alarms are sounding as we exit the building, not waiting for the alarm to sound then exiting.
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Like most things in the fire service it's got to be about taking care of the people you are working with and doing your assigned job. All of the gadgets and funny abreviations in the world can't do that. Most of the "accountabilty" crap seems to prevent accountability and creates a false sense that nothign bad could happen if we use the system.
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Permalink Reply by turk182 on
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Whe use a dry erase board that our firefighters tag into when going to assignments. We just started using it a few years ago and are using it in our training as well.
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You're going to tell me that with a GPS system as part of your gear, RIT is not going to find you?? Isn't that the very nature of GPS? Command can look at their screen and tell RIT exactly where to search. Clearly firefighters need to be trained in self rescue, etc, that wasn't the question you asked. Have you seen these units in practice? Impressive life saving tools.
PS - "nice answer though" - a little patronizing, no? If your mind is made up on the issue, why ask the question? Progress in the fire service is not such a bad thing.
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Permalink Reply by Mick Mayers on
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I think you are right on the money. As nice as some of this technology is, at the heart of the matter is this: are we teaching our firefighters to work within an organized approach to incident management or are we allowing them to do their own thing? If we have people who will not work within an established incident plan, maybe they need to find another line of work. Company officers: are you allowing this kind of "rogue mentality"? Or do you insist that crews stay within "voice, vision, or touch" and check in/check out of the Hot Zone?
I do, however agree with some of the other commenters (spanner's comment in particular) about the other personnel on the crew not having radios and this device being useful. Large area searches, fast movers, that kind of stuff- definitely useful. Normal operations in single family dwelling- probably not so much.
My point is that in some departments, this and other technologies are no substitute for good basic firefighting practices.
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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With regards to accountability, there wouldn't be any need to expand the process or to enhance the process through advanced technology if firefighters weren't still getting "lost".
Many of you have described a very uncomplicated system of accountability, but in reality, with all of the other activities taking place at the time of the emergency, just how uncomplicated does it remain?
When poor accountability at an incident is reported or it finds its way into an LODD report, it opens the doors to anyone wanting to sell you a "gimmick".
I agree that there are systems out there already that work if they are followed.
Yes, Mick; there is no substitute for good basic firefighting practices.
TCSS.
Art
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