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Comment by Firewriter on January 27, 2011 at 8:09pm

OH GOODY!! A wedding!!!!!!!! Details, details, details!! Oh, and tell your man he gets major points from us! First, for having such good taste in women; second, for manning up to any others who pull any crap! We like his style!!

Heather, that is why you and I practice the back-to-back weapons training all the time ... gives us that 360 degree view of anyone trying to cause grief! LOL!!

Comment by Fabulous Heather Days of Summer on January 27, 2011 at 7:53pm

Kayce - Firewriter - Sister you rock MORE - You are my Goddess !!! You know I got your back... and I know you have mine... Thanks for the honest dialogue. WOMEN ARE AWESOME - AND WE DESERVE TO BE TREATED AS SUCH !!!

You make a great point. Here is my personal email if anyone wants to talk to me privately which I read daily browhe@yahoo.com... And I am on here at least every 3 days, and do read my FFN email as well.

In general I am seeking to remove barriers - especially for women - for success in the fire service. This matter of sexuality is one of the biggest barriers, since the male-driven sexist brotherhood ran rampant for a century - and now - enough is enough - time to GROW THE HELL UP AND FLY RIGHT !!!

I want to TALK about things - I want to SHINE A LITE on things and I WANT TO MAKE PROGRESS ON THINGS and SOLVE THINGS - so the next generation of women do not have to fight so hard to do the job they love !!!

Carolyn - yes this issue is much bigger than our conversation with you - so please don't feel that we are just discussing your concerns. There is a bunch of crap that has been happening in the fire service and on this site - your thoughts reflect 20 others that I have heard this week alone. But we are going to turn this site around - AND make strides in the fire service as well.

So Carolyn - tell us about your upcoming wedding !!!

AND YES WE WANT PICTURES - did you pick flowers and dress and venue yet?

Comment by C. Elizabeth Bullock on January 27, 2011 at 7:16pm

Heather, Want to say ty for the support. I don't come from a family of Firefighters. I am the first. So I don't have the support of family and generations of firefighters to watch out for my welfare. I will tell you this: My soon to be husband is on the Fire Dept with me now and he will protect me at all costs. There will not be any more exual harrassment at the fire dept for me anylonger. As for on this site I'm so happy to know I will be heard if anything inappropriate should ever happen. I do need others support as I do not like confrontation and Heather you seem to be the person I would go to first. However,Firewriter and the Chief have earned my respect and confidence. I would also turn to them if necessary. But on a llighter note I would like to say ty to all of you who are and were concerned about me in this matter and I would like to move on and have a bit of fun in here knowing all is well. TY all so much for your concern. I love you all. You are my brothers and sisters. Thanks for watching out for me.

Comment by Firewriter on January 27, 2011 at 3:37pm

Good afternoon, ladies! I am quite excited to be here; appreciate the invitation!

Lady Heather, thank you for handling things while I was off of FFN during my intensive training last week (the same stuff I am still doing, but this is the easy part now!). It sounds like you had your hands full, my friend! Sorry to have abandoned you during such a crappy time.

Let me state – quite emphatically if I may – as Chief France's, "Second in Command", in the Back Room Crew, it is my hope that if you EVER have an issue with something in ANY of the rooms; you will let me know. You can contact me at my personal e-mail: Kayce.firewriter@gmail.com, if you do not feel comfortable approaching the issue on this site. Please give me a little time to respond (despite what some people may believe, I do sleep every few weeks!), but know that your concern will be addressed quickly and privately.

From having been with Chief France for almost a year in the BRC, I can personally assure you; at no time would he EVER condone behavior which would knowingly make any crew member – whether male or female – feel uncomfortable, demeaned, victimized, or in general, have a negative impact on their welfare. That is not, nor will it ever be, his way of doing things. He is truly one of the most honorable of men; someone who it is an honor for me to call, “friend”.

Yes, at times, some of us go a little overboard in our silliness; usually it is quite harmless. Had I been on FFN during the time the, "Pole Incident", took place, I assure you, my response would have caused third degree burns. I am quite glad I did not see it, as I am not too sure whose head would have rolled first! It is enough that we put up with guff every day for working in a, "man's world"; to think we can't even be on a web site without being ridiculed, mocked, or demeaned ... that is SO not happening!

Carolyn, I do hope you will rejoin us.

Justine … you rock! I want to be just like you when I grow up! ‘kay?

And, as always, Lady Heather – you rock!!

To you all - stay safe out there!

Comment by Fabulous Heather Days of Summer on January 27, 2011 at 2:38pm

Carolyn - the other issue I wanted to speak to was your report of sexual assault. I am so sorry that you experienced that. No one should EVER have to endure such pain and abuse - especially at work. I am so sorry that your FD did not have your back and it has become an experience that left you feeling as though the price of justice was way too high. I am so sorry for that.

I like Justine grew up around FFs so maybe I am more jaded than the average female. But I also recognize that I am much more protected - and the other FFs, or even community members will not mess with me, since they know lots of my family members are FD. So they better shut up and be supportive - or risk the FD NOT showing up and warmly savings their asses.

My brothers and sister and husband and brother-in-law and father-in-law, etc. etc. served on local depts and my dept - I know that no one would dare sexually assault or harrass me without feeling the wrath of them ALL pour heavily down upon them. As I have aged - I really that was a gift that most female FFs do not have - more and more and more report to be a long history of harrassment, and many repotr assault - as many women in the military also report. This disgusts me to no end AND IT NEEDS TO STOP.

I hope you will always have the courage to stand up for justice - even if you define just as living to fight another day by laying low and staying out of the bs. I respect that !!! We have to do what works for us ! If we don't take care of ourselves - who else is going take care of us !

I personally find it much easier to fight the battles of others than my own. Then again this seems to be true in many industries and environment, that is why they say about lawyers "A fool has himself for a lawyer" - since we all need SOMEONE ELSE in our corner to help us fight our battles - otherwise the fight can just beat us down TOO FAR!

I am not sure exactly how that dynamic was created within me, other than I have a long history - in my family and elsewhere of not really being listened to and provided for when I had needs. So now I pride myself in being able to hear the needs of others and help them. This is also helped me identify my needs and find SUPPORTIVE people to help me get my needs met.

So girl - please know I am here is you need anything. I got your back sister. And I know a bunch of others on here or elsewhere that we can recruit if you need an army to help. Sister you should never have to go through anything alone. Be strong sister!

Comment by Fabulous Heather Days of Summer on January 27, 2011 at 2:13pm

Hey Everyone - let us all invite our FFN lady friends to this group and give Justine some support as she builds up a place for the ladies to be ladies !!!

Yes, Carolyn to reflect Justine's comment about Chief Mike - my experience is that he is an honorable man too. But is it so tough in these public forums because 500 people in a group can run amuck. Starting a group on here does not necessarily make one the moderator, since we are all expected to police ourselves.

I noticed on this website that there are at least 2 Single Fire Fighter groups - one run by the FFN Webmaster - which appears to be closed now (probably due to abusive and innappropriate behavior) and the second one - which I am trying to get active again - which appears to have been abandoned by the starter of the group. It is tough - group leaders may not know they ARE THE LEADER when they open the group.

I don't think I can successfully lead the Single Fire Fighter group back on track - it is tough to LEAD and work, go to school, manage FD activity, take care of the family, have a life, and still police hundreds of people and thousands of comments - quite frankly I don't know how anyone can do it. Though I expect more from the webmasters, since I think they slack on moderating - but again for a FREE website - I am glad for the interactions I get - I think in general they do a bang up job - and I know they can't fix everything, when they haven't seen it yet.

Any time you have a concern - especially with the Chief's Back Room - I know Chief Mike and MOST of the others will help. I trust him, and most of them with my life, though I have never met them, and I trust many of them with my emotions - because I have seen his actions in work. This week I noticed he was able to carve out a bunch of crap that had filtered into his group of 500 + people. He also sent out an apology email to people for letting the group run away from his control.

Comment by C. Elizabeth Bullock on January 26, 2011 at 5:08pm

Yes the Chief did send me a message about the matter and he apologized for himslf too for letting it go like he did. He seems like a real sweetheart. Well I'm going to join the Chiefs Backroom again. Thanks Justine.

Comment by C. Elizabeth Bullock on January 26, 2011 at 1:41pm

Hi Heather. Thanks for your response. I find it better to keep my mouth closed in the fire service unless its physical. I can bs with the best of them. I chose not to be in the cheifs room any longer just because I like more specific rooms like vehicle extrication and wildland firefighting. I've nothing against anyone in the Cheif room. I would prefer to be myself in certain matters ie sexual harassment but would rather not do it on here as it will cause a windfall of abuse. At the firehouse I had to turn in a guy for touching my breast and was made to feel like shit from the whole dept because i was a newby at the time. Well Im no newby now and they all have given me respect in the end. Would I report him again? I think not because I dont want snyone written up but I would definately state my opinion to the individual involved. Ok I gota run. Thanks for the feedback Heather. Thats what we should all be doing. Helping each other. Till later,,,, Take care hun.

Comment by Fabulous Heather Days of Summer on January 26, 2011 at 2:22am

Hey Caroline - yes to address the issue about the pole - and other uncomfortable matters. Yes, I think a bunch of stuff on here - and everywhere in the fire service can be way over the top. I have learned to play along in certain settings and just stay away in other settings. I still have not found the official policies - other than like I mentioned in the other discussion - it seems if people are engaging amongst themselves and not attacking particular people - then not much is said or done.

I think people's personal lives should not be discussed on here unless they choose to talk about themselves. I have shifted much more into a Kitten with a Whip type behavior - instead of serious FF/EMT - and I know that is a position of danger - but it is clear in here - I get attacked much more when I act like a strong FF sister... so I present an alter ego instead.

Since currently I am retired from the fire service - I am way more relaxed than I should be - and the way I would be if I were active duty. I also have taken my full name off my user name for a little bit more anonymity - and I know lots of people set their pages to private.

I have people on here attack me for being single and for being a retired FF and for being female. None of which I can change about myself - it use to make me very upset - now I just ignore them or report them to the webmaster.

Yes, I thought matters like the pole discussion were offensive - but I personally have bigger problems on this site that offend me and bigger matters off cyber life to address - so I pick my battles. Several issues that I found offensive I either sent an email to the author privately - or started posting my concerns in the forum itself. Again I need to pick my battles. Mostly I just leave things that offend me and go elsewhere.

I can be a bit over the top sometimes - but I am very careful who I direct my comments to. Any that are mis-understood I go back and remove or clarify. Anytime that some ass responds abusively to me - I go back and remove my comments... or move them elsewhere... or report the attacker to the FFN webmaster. I use to stand up and defend myself on this site - but I discovered that those who attack and belittle on this site multiply their attack when anyone stands up to them - no matter what the issue.

And if I find that people enter my name into a discussion I do not like - lately I just publicly burn them - so they think twice about messing with me again.

I am no example good clean conduct on this site. You bring up interesting points - I have slid into the pit alongside the status quo... hmmm... you cause me to think... a few months ago... I would not have said a lot of my comments I do now - it seems I have developed a familiarity and friendship - or the perception of friendships - and therefore say pretty much anything which comes into my head. Such is the illusion that is the internet - total strangers are seemingly friends - and I guess the FD has removed a bunch of boundaries for me too. Which is probably not good - and you make excellent points - it can quickly move into sexual harrassment.

I don't have all the answers - heck I don't have any of the answers. Lots of stuff that would not be permitted in corporate america is a seeming every day experience in the fire/ems service.

Comment by C. Elizabeth Bullock on January 25, 2011 at 8:26pm

Captain Carlyn where are you?

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