The Social Network & Community JUST for Firefighters
Juniors-only Section
I have been watching some of the postings on here by the less than literate junior members lately. I have also seen some of the "I want to be a firefighter types" post some ridiculous things on here. These discussions inevitably turn into the "learn to spell" or "shut-up and learn" conversations. I am not saying I have not participated in them either. But, is there some way to limit the posting capabilities of members? What if the junior members were only able to post in the junior area? Or, what if they were not allowed on here at all? I am sure that they can figure out a way to get around any sort of age requirement for membership, they are a little smarter than that. But, if they start posting immature crap, turn off their capability to post at all. They can still learn an awful lot with a read-only account.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mike Schlags (Captain Busy) Retd on
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Dear Nick,
If one take the time to look at your profile and posts do you know what they will learn? They will figure out that you are not a firefighter, but instead an underage fire explorer who has demonstrated a lack of judgement and immaturity through your very own words on each and everyone of your posts to date and that reading your posts is an absolute waste of time.
That really makes the point as to why the adults on this site find it offensive for some of the juniors like yourself that really don't have a lot to offer, participating with an old timer's attitude in some of these discussions.
Now I could be wrong here. You could be actually sincere somehow in your intent but reading posts where you have both argued for juniors to be able to run calls is one of those, "and there's your sign..." kind of thing.
Additionally, on some of your posts where someone like myself, an old crusty nasty mean fire captain has called you on your BS you have simply deleted the replies that you did not find pleasant to have other people read. Check it out Nick, for those replying back to this post, all the replies are spelled correctly. And guess what, you can't delete this post!
Thank you for your time, speaking on behalf of what you labeled "immature adults" considering that as you can see, I am absolutely looking down at you Nick, shaking my head and sending you back home to your parents where they can finish teaching you some manners and respect for folks like myself who have actually risked their lives to save others and yes in some situations like myself, resulted in live changing injuries and disabilities. The only reason I am still alive young Nick is because I payed attention to detail.
So Nick, remember that there are folks out there that actually have to take on responsibility for not only themselves but their crew and the public we serve. You my friend are nothing but a liability and someone I would shudder to think that a department would allow someone with such a cocky attitude to be associated with their department. You wouldn't last a second on mine.
I am not sorry for speaking from the heart here. This is a serious job with serious consequences. I no longer feel the need to coddle juniors or be politically correct on the subject. Instead of wasting time on these nonsense posts, we, the fire service need to focus on the problems that not only face us now but will face us in the future.
For example, if you respond to a vehicle fire or tanker fire containing ethanol did you know that AFFF won't work? Do you know why? Do you know that the E85 fuels that contain ethanol are what is called a polar solvent, making traditional firefighting foam or the use of water an absolute waste of time.
Take the time to look up issues such as this where you will learn that you need an AR Foam, or alcohol resistive foam that creates a meniscus on the top of the fuel which snuffs out the fire. You may also have to look up meniscus...
Nick, don't get pissed when you read this post. Instead take the challenge to change everyone's perspective of you. You need to focus on school, learning and becoming better educated so you can offer something to society and yourself. To not do so would be, and this is the third time I've said this, an absolute waste of time.
Don't waste anyone else's time Nick. Thank you.
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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While I can agree with most of the points here, spelling/ grammar, maturity, etc, many of the issues can be dealt with by simple moderation too. There are so many like minded threads and many of the trivial ones which garner attention (helmet color, rig color, lights, etc) just keep going. Rarely do people do a search to see if there is an existing thread and some simple moderation can take care of that.
In actuality there is a junior only section, but if you are like me and go to forums and the latest posts, you get everything in every forum. I actually like that vs going to forum to forum. Then having a junior only section, what does that really accomplish? Because along with every junior/ explorer program there should be adults. Personally, I would hate for some junior coming on such a site and making the dept look bad because of their mouth or what they "think" they should be allowed to do. Letting juniors roam free is not an answer in my book. Despite the issues we do see, there are plenty of adults who do come in and address the issues. Problem is the same issues keep coming up on many threads and stuff can be handled with simple moderation.
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Perhaps moderation is the key here... I think to be a member of the FFN, one needs to click a box that says they are over 18 years of age. The conversations and subject matter, for firefighters I think, sometime touch on things that are inappropriate for young children under the age of 18.
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Permalink Reply by Smoke Eater on
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(Banging head on wall)
I am starting to agree that the juniors are taking over the site. Some do have valid questions and some, I believe, are just whackers. Do you really learn anything by asking about someone's blue or red lights? How about more questions about the job itself? How about things like when or where do you vent? When should you think about getting your crews out and go defensive?
Kids, these senior guys will take you more seriously if you actually showed some type of intrest in something more than truck or helmet colors. We have no problem explaining strategies or tactics to you, all you have to do is ask. You're best place to ask a question is at your dept. but we try to help eachother out here as well.
As far as respect goes, it's just like the real world on here. Respect is earned, not given. If you want to come on here and run off at the mouth, then expect no respect from the "old" guys. I have no problem helping juniors out, hell that's how I got started. But this is not the place to come on and act like you're hot s**t. I garauntee you don't act like that at your station. Don't act like that here.
Nick, like I said, I have no problem with junior or cadet firefighters. But when you come on here and talk down to the senior guys like you've done this job for 30 yrs. then I can't help you when I feel they are being a little too harsh on you. In fact, I refuse to help any juniors who come on here with an attitude toward the senior firefighters at all. I have 14 yrs. in and still have the utmost respect for the guys and ladies who have been doing this longer than me.
Ok. I think I've ranted long enough. Quitting smoking is proving to be harder than I thought.
TCSS Everyone and Happy New Year!!!
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Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on
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I too have read and commented on your posts. I truly appreciate them and they make me think. As a hazmat team member, technical rescue team member, etc., I think there needs to be more of the types of posts that make one think, "what would you do".
Happy New Year
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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The junior/explorers have their own section here. Home page. Scroll down.
Juniors and Explorers
The place for junior and explorer firefighters to connect, share program ideas and more.
But apparently, it takes too much time to scroll then click, so they just drop their doo doo in the General Discussions thread, not unlike almost everyone else.
75% of the juniors that come here are well mannered and respectful, for the most part. Yeah; the question that they ask is one we may have seen a thousand times, but at least they aren't like the other 25% who believe that we are a roadblock to their development as a firefighter wannabee.
Where I am on the board of a website, we have a junior/explorer section, encourage them to use it, if they post in a discussion thread other than the junior section, the moderators look at it and may leave it or move it to the junior section. It has worked very well. We have mentors that go to the junior section and answer questions. But it is also a smaller site than FFN.
If by some chance, the juniors were rounded up and put in their dedicated section, it would have to be moderated because you have guys like Nick who would bully the other juniors, offer bad advice and "teach" them that adults are the enemy. The moderator would have to tell Nick to sit down and STFU.
Junior/explorers aren't a bad lot, but sometimes I think that the entire process shouldn't start at all until they are 18. That way, you aren't dealing with infantile attitudes like Nick's. 18 may not be the panacea, but I'm willing to bet that you have a better shot due to the maturity component.
And yes, Nick; there are some "adults" who are every bit as immature as you, but as you know, two wrongs don't make a right. You should never try to advance your argument by arguing that someone else does or doesn't do it. That in itself shows an immaturity.
IMHO.
Art
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You are so right. What was I thinking engaging with this Junior issue? I now feel challenged to come up with another scenario... maybe hydrofluoric acid or something sweet like that... you know, something to make you think about real firefighter stuff, not whether you can put a lights and sirens on your bicycle to respond to the station from home... Can you believe that this is how low the FFN post have gone? Again, we need to take back this site and having a Junior's only section, a place for the kids to be with their own kind... it would be a good thing don't you think? CBz
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Well said my friend... Wishing you and everyone else here on the FFN a prosperous and safe 2010. Happy New Year! CBz
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Permalink Reply by Fireyladd - Retired Chief Sharp on
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As many of us have said all along, the bad spelling/grammar, attitudes and down right stupid redundant discussions has more then provided ample reason to limit Jr's access here. How thats accomplished is entirely up to the site administrator. Primarily it is the few that screw things up for most.
As long as this site is open to all who join there will continue to be those who pose themselves as someone they are not (firefighters, EMS, Emergency Services), attempt to sell/advertise their wares, or simply lie an attempt to impress. The site administrators do a fare job of weeding these annoying idiots out of here.
Bottom line is this site is free to us all and being here for some time now I have seen many changes good and bad. However, the site is still here, we are enjoying its service and there is a door out if we do not like it. Express your ideas, concerns and comments to the administrators.
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Chief Sharp, I believe that the administrators do a good job reading posts, especially when the post title deals with webpage / website formatting and policy issues. One thing that leads me to believe that they do respond to our comments was my reference recently to the number of posts listed on the main webpage and that on average, 50% of them originate from Fire Rescue Magazine verses leaving room for posts put out by the membership.
Now when you combine this fact with Junior's overwhelming the posts, this leaves no room for actual discussions about fire department issues generated by what I have been referring to as "real firefighters", which in my opinion should be the heart and soul of this site.
There is a good reason why Fire Rescue magazine invested in this site. It's to generate revenue and income for their magazine and share holders. This is a good thing. We need them to be successful to ensure that this site is supported and online. I'm pretty sure that they are just as unhappy as the firefighters who participate in this site with the myriad of posts that are less than relevant to most of us.
So, let's all wait and see what the WC and FRM staff come up with to deal with what we have all brought to light as a real issue and problem.
Happy New Year! CBz
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So, it's a waste of time to try to minimize the nonsensical chatter that was the impetus of this post? To not like something, and to be told that if you don't like it you can exit using a door...
I don't like the analogy and can't support it. Why? How is this any different than saying that you need to just go along with the status quo? To not endeavor to create change when change is needed, to allow a minority to influence the direction that is not in the best interest to the whole group is just plain wrong.
So what happens if you like it? I don't think leaving is an option... I am not a quitter and I know you are not one either.
The direction that this site has been going lately has moved to the more social side of the site verses firefighter related topics that are pertinent. With the hoidays, and time off issues from kids in school, there seems to be an increased number of posts from children using this site in the same way one would use facebook.
It's really heard to mix kids and adults. Apples and oranges... I don't think anyone has to leave however. We just have to be patient for school to start again after the holidays...
Cheers! CBz
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