Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by paul michael komandt on April 20, 2009 at 9:45pm

YEAH FRUSTRATES ME TOO. PERSONALLY IF THE OFFICERS DONT WANT TO LEAD, OR FOR BETTER TERMS, SHOW THEIR OWN DISCIPLINE THEN WHY ARE THEY OFFICERS? MEMBERS DONT NEED TO BE SUSPENDED JUST TALKED TO AND KEEP A RECORD OF THESE INFUCTIONS, AND WHEN YOU CAN SHOW THAT THEY ARE NOT GETTING THE POINT THEN YOU CAN SAY GOODBYE TO THE TROUBLE MAKERS. SAFETY COMES FIRSTAND IF YOU CANT FOLLOW RULES OR SOP's THEN YOU ARE GONNA HURT SOMEONE.

Permalink Reply by Mike Holden on April 25, 2009 at 11:09pm

# 1 Get good leadership and that means starting with the chief. Get your local board of directors involved if necessary. Failure to have good leadership means firefighters get hurt or killed.

#2 The answer is yes if a suspension and /or dismissal are warranted. Again failure to follow department rules and/or department SOP mean firefighter injuries and deaths.

#3 Recruit people that understand that the rule are there to keep them safe and alive to go home to their families. You may find that weeding out wrong- doers and troublemakers will draw members of your community that may not have consider joining before.

Our Department has a printed SOP that is handed out to every new member when they join our department. They are required to sign a statement that they have read and understand what is required of them before they a issued any gear. Failure to follow the rules as presented in our SOP’s result in
First offence a written warning
Second offence up to a 30 day suspension
Third offence Dismissal from the department
Understand an offence that is major in nature can result in an immediate dismissal.

Remember that wrong-doers or trouble makers lower department moral and the number of quality members that will respond.

Permalink Reply by PFC Harmon on April 26, 2009 at 9:43pm

Like the other two guys said you need leadership. In my department if you don't play by the rules you turn in all your crap and hit the door, bottom line.

Permalink Reply by Randy Fales on April 29, 2009 at 7:57pm

I know what you mean I've been on for 5yrs now. I just became a training officer and it's harder than hell to get some of our guys to do anything. There reason is well were just volunteers we don't get paid to do things. And i always tell them either do it or get the hell out of the way so the one's who want to learn and do things can. Then they say well you think your better than us because you are going to classes and doing all the trainings, cause they have been on longer they think that they know everything and don't have to participate. I'm trying to make were when we get new guys the rule is you either do the drills and training or don't let the door hit you on the ass

Permalink Reply by Marty D. Ross on April 29, 2009 at 8:06pm

In our department we have found that discipline can take many forms. Sometimes you just have to treat a kid like a kid. Now I'm not tring to be mean, but as asst. chief , I have found more results from a simple you can't go on calls for a while. Or you have some extra chores to do. Just like I would treat my kids. If there is to much radio traffic we take the transmitt side out of there radio's, not to be mean but you have to look at what you need to do, then do it....

Permalink Reply by Rick on May 5, 2009 at 8:09am

The way I look at it, Volly, Call, or otherwise, I would rather have 5 guys show up constantly that I know won't get me killed, than 20 who I would never set foot in a building with. I agree with those below who said it all starts with the leadership. Without good leadership, everything else is broken. I will never understand why some departments would rather have a large roster half filled with members that treat it like a social club over a smaller roster of guys who do the job right. I have seen it before, and it will probably always be an issue in a dept that's staffed mostly by Volly's/Call guys. The best thing you can do is search out the ones who do care, bond with and learn from them, and try and lead by example...

Permalink Reply by LVVFD622 on May 12, 2009 at 8:09am

Discipline in the Fire Department I am in is handled as what I feel is the way it should. We have what we call the Fire Counsel. The Fire Counsel is comprised of all the officers of the Fire Department, this includes all Line Officers and Business Officers. If something is severe enough to have Discipline to a member, the FC meets and discusses what needs to be done. The FC has the ability to suspend, fine, remove from office (if they hold one), and/or dismiss the guilty party from the Fire Department. In nut shell it's like our own court system. I have seen it do some good things as far as the Discipline of the Fire Department. Fell free to comment on this.

622 Clear

Permalink Reply by Mark Klaene on May 16, 2009 at 10:07pm

suspension and termination are options even in the volunteer service
All members must be assets to teh service. IF they are not then they should not be there . But more importantly when they pose a risk to the service or personnel then they must go--either temporarily of permanently

Permalink Reply by Bobby on June 3, 2009 at 7:01pm

well i would suggest that your officers GROW A SET we have had to suspend a few for not following orders and i must be honest I have been on the verge of being suspended for being insubordinate but got away not with a talking to, but a serious butt chewing. key thing is that even though we are 100% volunteer we still have to follow orders or we don't get to play

Permalink Reply by Eddie Rogers on June 5, 2009 at 2:31am

I will agree with the rest. LEADERSHIP IS KEY!!!!!!!!! I will add that the wrong doers, and rule breakers will drag a department down in a hurry. I don't mean the ones who occasionally mess up like once a year, but the guys or gals that consistently bail on training nights because they used to be the cheif, or the people who will drive by a working fire, go home and go to bed, the ones who want the title, but don't want to put in the work it requires. These are the ones that will kill our PR (public relations), people in the community will noitce things and if officers, and leaders in the department are not willing to take a stand then all is lost. We set up a review board every six months to review attendance to meetings and runs. The individual get a letter and 60 days to shape up or ship out. Serious offences are usually handled by our offices which I am proud to say I am a part of. We try to sit down at least once a quarter at minimum and discuss issues, and review things just if nothing else, to make sure were all on the same page. My favorite saying is "WE MAY BE VOLUNTEERS, BUT WE MUST BE PROFESSIONAL"

Permalink Reply by Jack on June 22, 2009 at 6:43am

This is a question that I have been asking for some time now. And I agree that it has to start at the top with strong and respected leadership. Things are difficult when you are dealing with Volunteers and the "clicks" that can be in existence in the station. Our problem is that the Fire Service is ever changing. The trainings and the way things were done 20 or 30 years ago won't fly any more.

People are also very quick to point out the things that people do wrong and they should. Free Lancing, unsafe practices need to be stopped. Rules are in place to govern the masses not the individuals. But, I think that this is a 2 sided issue. It is also about retention as well. Reconigize individuals as well. An officer in the company Lt., Capt., Chief, what ever the level should reconigize individuals in front of their peers. Give them something. Dept. T's Duty shirts, what ever. Make it specific to a call something that the officer say and felt that should be rewarded. It will make the discipline side easier.

Remember "Praise in front of their peers...Discipline in private"

Permalink Reply by Lou Anne on June 29, 2009 at 11:24pm

If you get an answer I would like to know the answer. We have by-laws and we have some people that think they can do what they want but the rest of us have to get prior approval.

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• Next ›
• Page