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FDNY hiring practices called Apartheid like
http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2010/01/barrett_39.php
A very interesting article on the NYFD
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Jeff Cole on
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There are aways those looking to blame somebody...anybody for their failures or dissapointments. This isn't limited to FDNY as we all know. Some years back the validity of a civil service test was challenged because of a specific componenet; the tunnel crawl! Yes, a dark tunnel, in which you had to negotiate a fairly straight course on your hands and knees was challenged by a minority group as being somehow discriminatory, and not essential to the job of a firefighter. Amazing!
I can only relate my opinions of the requirements for this profession based on my past 30-some years on the job, and a lifetime of involvement in the fire service. I even failed my very first written exam, and was crushed, so I know the feeling. Even with a fairly good knowledge of firematics, I failed. However I didn't blame anyone but myself. I really don't how I failed, or where I screwed up, but I didn't blame the testing procedure.
Now, after three decades and then some, I find myself in a position in which I need to be educated, socially appropriate, articulate, business savy, and politically informed. All that AND trained and educated to the absolute maximum of my ability. So to me, I just cannot fathom the idea of getting by with an 8th grade education, or less, and being capable of understanding principles and practices, tactics and stratigies, and the required document-preparring skills and everything else that goes with excelling in this profession.
THE BLAME of failure to pass, and place well on a civil service or other type entry tests should be placed on the individual. Yes, I completely agree that parents, or lack of parenting is the first failure. Self-absorbed, lazy, uninvolved, chemically addicted, or criminal, black, white, hispanic, asian...PARENTS have failed miserably in their responsibility to see that their children are educated, and that they are taught social skills that will help them to become responsible adults. It is NOT the job of the school systems to socially educate children, to teach them simple traits that will help them through society. Parents have failed...period.
However, once we get to the high school age...where we are basically who we will be, it's all on YOU! There is proof everyday, everywhere for the 16, 17, 18 year-old that your life is going to be exactly what YOU make it. And if your eyes are closed, and suddenly some doors are slammed in your face because you cannot articulate a sentence, or read an application, or spell your address...YOU did that! Look in the mirror. Nope, it's always someone else's fault!
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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Brian,
At the time I didn't care where I landed a job. Much of this testing was 10 or more years ago. I've been on the job in my hometown for seven years now. Tell you the truth, I'm glad I'm not with FDNY, not so much for the busy aspect, but the cost of living. I know of a fellow classmate who did take the same test I did and did take the job. He has since resigned and was hired on his hometown FD. So basically there are pros and cons anywhere.
As for the name drops, I did so because I did take numerous tests and out of the tests I took I found FDNY to be the easiest, which is why it mind boggles me to try and understand where someone calls the test racist or even apartheid like. I applied to big cities, I applied to small, some asked for more certs, some didn't care, but in the end it boils down to some self initiative to pass. Really there is nothing racist or apartheid like to simple math, reading, and writing skills, if you can't pass such a test, then you don't deserve the job....plain and simple.
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Sorry Brian....not everyone can go Navy.
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Saw that article too Jack....speaks volumes for our education standards today....but I agree, how ironic is it not being called racist and apartheid like?
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Permalink Reply by Brian Dumser on
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I wanted to join the Navy like my Father and Grandfather, but I scored too high on the intelligence test! Bwahahahha!
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Too bad you lacked the common sense to read which contract you were signing then.
:-)
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Permalink Reply by joemac on
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The continued dumbing down of America.
Look through the posts of any Online forum. Lack of punctuation, atrocious spelling, horrible grammar...
We put up with it. "It's not my place to correct someone else."
Otherwise intelligent people don't seem to know the differences between, "then" and "than", "there, their" and, "they're", "your" and "you're" and we just put up with it.
I see the word, "definitely" mis-spelled more than spelled correctly.
I used to correct others, because I felt that I was a part of the problem if I didn't make some sort of attempt to help. Too often, I was criticized as being part of the Grammar Police (usually, "Grammer").
I only graduated high school, but it was at a time when you had to pass the tests to graduate. Now, it's more common to be pushed through and given a diploma, rather than having to earn one. Keep those numbers up.
Things have changed. We've become lazy, with a common sense of entitlement. We're all to blame, because we just whine and complain, but no one does anything about it.
Both of my sons are in their twenties, and I'm still constantly correcting them. "Should have went..."????
I don't think I've ever heard my wife correct either of them. As a matter of fact, I have to correct her, too.
When I stop, it means I no longer care.
I'll say this: I have a difficult time respecting someone who can't use basic English and mis-spells words, especially when there is spell-check. It's one thing if your native language is something other than English, but even then, it's still matter of caring. I guess we just don't care any more.
*Rant over*
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Permalink Reply by Mark Oomkes on
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So, exactly how does ink on a piece of paper formed into letters>words>questions become racist?
Isn't implying that a test is racist, racist in and of itself? Because when it comes down to it, just posing the question implies minorities are less intelligent than the majority, which we know is not true.
As an aside, the ending of Apartheid did not make S. Africa a better place to live. Not saying Apartheid was right, but the country has gone downhill since.
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