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VES
I know there's a lot of smaller volunteer departments on here and I was just curious how many of you use VES on a regular basis.(Career departments too) VES, Vent Enter Search for those that don't know, seems like it would actually be fairly beneficial to smaller departments because you can get more done at once. Here the hook man on the truck and sometimes the tillerman will perform VES. We already have the bar man inside forcing doors and searching by himself in front of the engine company. Then the rescue squad has two teams searching as well. If the hook man is throwing ladders, it saves time if he just does a quick search since he's already breaking out the window.(We never throw a ladder without breaking the window. Otherwise there's no point in the ladder)
Here's a nice video by a guy I work with. He's the tillerman on 17 Truck. It shows how quick you can have a ladder up, ventilate, perform a search, and get out by yourself. He recorded it with his helmet cam and used it for a training company run by himself, other DCFD guys, and some FDNY guys. Hope this helps some people. He has several others on YouTube as well that are interesting.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John on
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Very Nice video...Our dept. does VES training at least once a year, and some of our other training we do the officers always advise us that VES could be done at that point in our evolutions.
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Permalink Reply by capcityff on
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One reply on a topic that doesn't involve tshirts, helmet color, or seatbelts? : / Kind of weird that that's more interesting than tactics.
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Permalink Reply by FETC on
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Well Cap, I can say yes. Not at every fire, but dependant upon the report, tasks required and manpower. We are a combo dept and our manpower does change depending on call volume at the time of the fire. Here is a pic from 1999. Direct access to room's above the fire is quicker, but can be dangerous. It is not for the in-experienced firefighter regardless of paid or volunteer.
We had a pretty good debate on FFN over another video for which a VERY experienced; VES trained and regularly used jake, made entry, attempted to close the room's common hallway door, but was obstructed and was forced to retreat as the VES room was overtaken by fire.... now it is a calculated risk, and with the task, most of the time it doesn't end that way but that fire had an exception, it was the obstructed door that communicated fire into the VES room.
Boy re-read some of the comments on VES tactics, like what it is, how it should have been done... and you will find why your replies to this thread are few on how does smaller departments perform VES. Most don't.
Heres the link:
http://www.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/flashover-what-the-he...
I personally like it, when applied appropriately and with coordination. But I also train on VES, with my crew and to others in the industry.
FETC
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Permalink Reply by 55 TRUCK on
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VES is a great tool. It is not a complex thing to pull off. Especialy for small vol dept. with low staffing.
The key is training,training,training,training,etc,etc.
check flr get in secure door. sweep get the Fudgesicles outa dodge, rinse repeat at next window.(If possible). It does tend to get you a bit warm. One of my fellow Truckies, did a VES on a House fire wih reported entrapment. He had to bail back out the window. He new the door may not shut cause of th crap aroud it.
Later somone asked him why with the conditions present he still went in. "There could of been a kid in there". Was all he said.
You take the risk to make the Grab.
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Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on
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Great video, I will share this with my crew then our truck companies. Thanks for putting it on. I like the cutting the bars on one side, that really speeds things up.
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You have only had it up a day, sheesh! But I agree, I would hope for more talk about how to do our job instead of what color the fire truck should be.
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Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
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Just a guess but...if you're just saving the foundation there's really no need to VES.
We've trained on it, but probably not enough...we have few structure fires, mostly cooking or electrical that gets knocked down quickly. There's been a LOT of suburban development and many of the old burnable buildings have been taken down and replaced with new, up to code McMansions. When one of those goes up, I'll let you know how well our training has been.
So...what color turnout gear do you use for VES?
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Permalink Reply by WestPhilly on
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We've always used VES in Philly, we just never called it that. I think our technical term was something like "Get the fuck in there, jerkoff!" I'm gonna start using that VES term. Maybe it'll catch on.
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WestPhilly. "Get the fuck in there, jerkoff!" is the long scientific technical term for VES. That all us sofistica ,uh sofist..intelmagent city firemen use.
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You're right, 55. I'm shit-canning that VES thing. Sounds kinda prissy.
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haha... I was trying to seem educated when I posted this. I don't want to get into details of what really happens in DC. We all know where that would go. A decent website though is actually called http://vententersearch.com There's some decent information on there. Usually a good amount of east coast related stories.
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Permalink Reply by Roy Walker on
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Thanks for an excellent video. Just some quick questions for my own information . I take it that the operation has a partner watching for the interior man to reappear. Is it relayed to accountability for tracking ? Then lastly is there not a chance of the interior hose team driving fire onto the searcher. I intend to research this but I just asked this so opinions from someone who uses this are available to me thanks.
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