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An interior attack team with 2 guys and thats it.
I took a command class last year and one of my instructors showed use a video clip of a bid city department that showed up to a structure fire in the city, and there was the engine driver and passenger, they got out and rung a hydrant that was next door to the hose that was on fire after that one guy get the hose brought up to the home while the other guy gets the water going and they both pack up and go into this smoke filled home together and there's no one left outside, and this was all done in the matter of minutes, it looked like it was maybe an older video but the instructor said that this still happens in big city. I just wanted to know if this still happens out there and if so why? The city that was featured in this video was Chicago...........................sorry Brian.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Spanner 122 on
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I live in a big city, my fire department is top ten in North America for size and this does not happen on my department. We actually have a rural station with only two firefighters and they are not, under any "Normal" circumstances to enter a structure without another rig on scene (rescue supercedes "normal"). Not only is it safer to have a crew ready or able to help outside (according to NFPA's 2 in, 2 out).. also, if there are any problems with water, pressure, hoselines, etc... who is going to fix that. If you are inside and the conditions change quickly and the line goes dead... etc, etc... too many variables to turn that situation into a disaster/tragedy.
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Permalink Reply by Jay Nicholson on
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Back in the early 90's a few depts around here eliminated almost all OT. There was many a shift where if someone called in sick, the engine was short staffed. This meant 2 guys riding instead of 3. As I recall, there were not too many agressive interior attacks done then.
Some of the bigger depts would rotate house closures. 18s was closed almost daily due to staffing shortages.
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Permalink Reply by T.J. on
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I totally agree with you, it was a vidoe and it looked like it might have been no longer than 10 years old, but I could not believe it, there so no sound to it so I'm not sure why they woul've entered a burning house like that, maybe some of the guys that've been around will remember something.
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Permalink Reply by rfdjumper on
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That's just the way we do it, except the crewman grabs the knob and off he goes. Pump operator does his thing. Granted there is a ladder, a rescue and 2 other engine enroute. A 4th engine is dispatched for RIT. For the first few minutes though its John Wayne time. An aggressive interior attack is our bread and butter. A good majority of our construction is turn of the century brick row home with a lot of common cocklofts and a common "Philadelphia rain gutter". A delay in getting water on the fire can result in multiple exposures going up.
I know a lot of you are going that's nuts. That is our reality.
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thats what I wanted to know, thanks for being honest and though there's times we want to do it, we wait tell we've got the right amount of guys:)
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Permalink Reply by Damon Dyer on
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The city next to us has 4 people on duty at a time when they go to a call they all go in separate truck , three engines and a rescue . They send in two guys and no backup .
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Permalink Reply by Capt.Alex Arnold on
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WE are a small rural district and that maybe all we have on the first due is two. Our norm is if a rescue is needed or called for they do it. If not then they size up and begin putting the proper things into place until the next company(s) arrive. They go into defensive mode and readdress once personnel arrive, (not hearing they are in enroute.) RECCO is how it goes.
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Permalink Reply by mike wright on
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I am in a rural department and this doesnt happen here. We wait until there is atleast another team to come in if need be before we go in. Don't the rule say 2 in and 2 out? This should never happen under normal circumstances. This is just a risky move on their behalf and could end up costing them thier lives.
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Permalink Reply by Brian Dumser on
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No skin off my nose! I'm in the suburbs of Chicago, (Chicagoland as I call it). That's not a good tactic leaving nobody at the pump panel! What happens when a kid or some wannabe goes to the panel and starts messing with stuff and shuts down your hoseline? NOT GOOD! I can only hope that this video was from a LONG time ago! This sounds like the HAZMAT video of the Chicago LT who dips his bare finger into a substance that's leaking from a rail car and then licks it! Luckily for him it turned out to be corn syrup! As Carlos Mencia would say, "Dee de dee!" Stay safe!
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Permalink Reply by Lou Angeli on
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Fire administrators have been arguing staffing for years. For example, Rural Metro actually operates one-man companies, as do some agencies in California. Firefighting tactics are developed assuming staffing of four per engine, ladder or rescue. Experts agree that a working house fire requires 14-16 firefighters, less the RIT crew.
Many of you may remember a serious fire that took place around Christmas in 1999. The blaze killed 6, including three career firefighters, just a week after the Worcester tragedy. Only 6 firefighters responded to the house fire, including the duty officer. On arrival, the structure was well involved and persons were reported. Rescue was the priority and everyone, including local police, went interior -- with a booster line. The building flashed and the rest is history.
The sad thing is that the career department did not have an automatic mutual aid agreement with nearby volunteers. If several departments rolled up simultaneously at the Keokuk job, the outcome would have been much, much different.
4-person staffing on the Engine and the Truck. And whatever happened to "2 in, 2 out?"
Lou
"Never Forget 9/11" (burn the candle)
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"The only exception would be if there was a confirmed victim trapped inside who was rescue-able and not simply a recovery case. Even then, it would be a quick search and rescue and not a fire attack."
wow and you come down on me for not wearing a nomex Ed.......................... thats like double standard there.
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