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Safe Speeds?
Is there a "safe way" or "safe speed" to "speed" on the interstate or any non-residential/city/town road? Basically, is it safe(on a normal day-perfect weather) to go 70 mph on an interstate that says 65 mph? Aside from the fact you don't want to get pulled over-are there any reasons not to go 5 mph(and 5 mph ONLY!) over the speed limit? Will those 5 mph make much of a difference in a crash?
What about going too slow? This would be more of an accident waiting to happen, right?
Thanks!!
TCSS!
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Pararescue on
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There is no need to do 70 in a 65. If your late your late. In an accident, ya 5 mph make a lot of difference! Think of this, a head on crash with both drivers doing the same speed is the same as hitting a wall at the impact speed. Impact speed is 65 + 65, 130 mph. Would you do that at a brick wall? Now increase by "only 5 mph" per car. Now we hit 140 mph, not much of a difference, right? Have you ever been to an accident at a mall or a parking lot? Cars are at 10-15 mph each, right? How many MVA's are cut jobs, even if it's to "pop" a door? Their impact speed is only 30 mph, and your cutting them out. If your looking for justification, it's not happening.
Watch the video. How fast is the 'Vette when he hits the TT? 150 mph?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pU8EMKc_Ss
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Permalink Reply by Roy Walker on
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Speed limits are speed limits there can be no justification for disobeying any traffic laws ,the end result can only be disastorous. Getting there is your primary purpose and think of the results when you don't. Aside from you not being there to help now your department needs to handle a second call pulling resources from your first call.
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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So are you asking this in context to driving your own POV and not as a FD response?
The answer given by LE is even 5 over is speeding, even one over is speeding, now many wouldn't pull you over, and may just get a warning, but if LE wanted to push it, you could get a ticket for speeding. Why even bring the subject up, do you have a lead foot problem?
What about going too slow? This would be more of an accident waiting to happen, right?
If on the interstate, yes. There is a minimum speed for the interstate, typically 45 and is sometimes posted in different states. So yes, a vehicle going too slow can lead to a potential accident.
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Permalink Reply by Fabulous Heather Days of Summer on
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Crabbe makes some good distinction - what the PD will ticket is not the same as what will kill you faster.
There are many times when going slower is essential and important, and the posted speed limit should not encourage you to speed up..
It is essential that you use your critical thinking skills when driving - such as rain, slow down... snow, sleet, black ice, wind, dust, fog, dark... SLOW DOWN !!!
Tractor trailers and vehicles which are high or hauling need to be especially cautious in high wind areas - and no matter how smooth a low profile car can progress through the winds - trucks that do not slow down dramatically can and do get blown over.
And I have lived a lot in snow country and steep curvy mountains - and people in those areas rarely ride at the height of the speed limit - instead you "drive for the conditions"
Use your hazard lights if you are driving dramatically below the speed limit - and everyone else is not - such as when you have car trouble.
Montana did (does) have "safe and prudent" speed limits on many of its road - meaning the driver must decide what is a safe speed to drive HOWEVER, the PD can also pull you over and ticket you for your selected speed, challenging that you were not being prudent in your speed choice and can (do) write you a ticket for driving recklessly.
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As far as the FD - I know of FFs that have received tickets from the PD enroute to a fire with their lights on - because the FF was driving too fast for the conditions and exceeding the safe (and posted) speed limit.
I also know of at least 2 incidents when the PD showed up on scene and gave a speeding ticket to a FF in a POV with lights on to a fire scene and another time a FF who was driving a fire engine with lights and sirens to a structure fire - the PD said "be glad it was not a ticket for reckless endagerment for repeatedly not acting with due diligence at intersections which could have led to a traffic accident"
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Permalink Reply by ashfire on
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We were told in driving class for emergancy response during daylight, dry weather and road traffic conditions that we can drive 10 MPH over the posted speed limit. Night and inclement weather speed has to meet the speed limit.
This is covered by county SOPs for driving.
Another thing is that all county apparatus have recording devices mounted in them so any incidents will be recorded for investigation purposes.
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NFPA counsels always follow local and state traffic laws... maybe Bz can find the actual law to post.
http://www.nfpa.org/newsReleaseDetails.asp?categoryid=488&itemI...
reports
News releases
Vehicle crashes cause more firefighter deaths than fires, NFPA study finds
Last year more died in on-duty crashes than any year since 1977June 9, 2004 – Firefighters are more likely to die traveling to or from a fire than fighting one, and motor vehicles pose a greater hazard than flames, according to new data from the National Fire Protection Association (NFPA). All told, 105 firefighters died while on duty in 2003, up from 97 in 2002, primarily because of last year's bad wildland-fire season.
Last year, 37 firefighters died while responding to or returning from alarms, while 29 died on the "fire ground" – the land or building where a fire occurs. That was the lowest number of firefighter deaths on the fire ground since NFPA began collecting the data in 1977, and the first time fire-ground deaths accounted for less than 30 percent of the total.
The NFPA's annual study of on-duty firefighters' deaths also found that 33 firefighters died in crashes in 2003 – more than in any other year since 1977.
In the most catastrophic incident, eight firefighters returning from a wildland fire were killed when their van crossed the center line while passing another vehicle and collided head-on with a tractor-trailer truck, bursting into flames. Alcohol was a factor in the crash.
Of the 37 firefighters who died traveling to or from an incident, 24 were involved in collisions or rollovers. Eight of those firefighters were not wearing seat belts and at least six were speeding.
For example, a firefighter driving to the fire station to respond to a flooding emergency hydroplaned and struck a signpost. He was driving too fast for the weather conditions and was not wearing a seat belt. In another fatal incident, the driver of a tanker lost control on a downhill
"These data tell us that many firefighters' deaths are preventable," said Rita F. Fahy, manager of fire databases and systems for NFPA. "We owe it to the people who bravely respond to emergencies to make sure they get there safely. That means proper training and equipment, and adhering to standards. Obeying traffic laws, using seat belts, driving sober and controlling speeds would also dramatically reduce this awful toll."
NFPA has developed two standards to help fire departments establish safe-driving programs: NFPA 1002, Standard on Fire Apparatus Driver/Operator Professional Qualificationsand NFPA 1451, Standard for a Fire Service Vehicle Operations Training Program. (Review these two documents online for free.)
Stress and overexertion remained the leading cause of fatal injury in 2003, as they have been almost every year. Last year, 47 firefighters died from stress-induced heart attacks (including eight that occurred traveling to or from an incident). That's more than the 37 heart-attack deaths in 2002 and almost 10 percent more than the average of the past 10 years.
Eleven of the 47 heart-attack victims in 2003 were known to have heart problems (usually previous heart attacks or bypass surgery).
NFPA studies consistently find that about half the victims of fatal heart attacks had suffered previous heart attacks or undergone bypass surgery and an additional third had severe narrowing of the arteries. Comprehensive safety and health programs, such as those outlined in NFPA standards, could prevent such fatalities.
NFPA has been a worldwide leader in providing fire, electrical, building, and life safety to the public since 1896. The mission of the international nonprofit organization is to reduce the worldwide burden of fire and other hazards on the quality of life by providing and advocating scientifically-based consensus codes and standards, research, training and education. NFPA headquarters is located in Quincy, MA, USA.
Contact: Margie Coloian, Public Affairs Office: +1 617 984-7275
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you are 16 years old - if you get ANY speeding tickets it can lead to you lose your right to have a basic driver's license until age 18
AND will mess up your insurance...
and God-forbid you kill someone...
also at age 16 your fire department should NOT be encouraging or supporting you BREAKING ANY LAWS ... FOR ANY REASON....
many departments do not let minors respond in their POV's or have a light permit
do the speed limit... and live to become a full-status firefighter
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I am not sure who or why someone is teaching that going over the speed limit by 10 mph is acceptable...
and County SOP's support it....
hmm... doesn't make a lot of SAFETY sense - which is our business !!!
in my area a PD officer enroute to a call was doing 10 mph over the 25 mph speed limit - with lights - no sirens... and a 7 year old girl ran into the road and was run over by the police officer... because with the little extra speed - he was UNABLE TO STOP when something unexpected happened...
in my area 2 Police cars crashed into a suspect they were chasing - guy was evading the police and 2 police cars were following, when the suspect missed a turn and went off the road - the 2 police cars immediately following also went of the corner - because they were travelling TOO FAST for the corner - all 3 cars were reported to be within a few mph of the roads speed limit - everyone was seriously injured
I could go on - but these are too prime examples of a little bit of extra speed having catastrophic results - not just for one, but many people.
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google is your friend...
here are some traffic safety statistics
http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pubs/810998.pdf
http://www.cid.army.mil/documents/Safety/Current%20Focus/Speeding%2...
http://www.iihs.org/research/qanda/speed_limits.html
http://www.iihs.org/research/qanda/speed_limits.html shares this
Yes. Speeding is a factor in about one-third of all fatal crashes, killing nearly 900 Americans every month. In 2009, speeding was a factor in 31 percent of motor vehicle crash deaths, killing 10,591 people. Based on a nationally representative sample of police-reported crashes, in 2009 speed was a contributing factor in about 17 percent of property-damage-only crashes and 22 percent of crashes involving injuries or fatalities. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) estimates that the economic cost of speed-related crashes is more than $40 billion each year.1
In a high-speed crash, a passenger vehicle is subjected to forces so severe that the vehicle structure cannot withstand the force of the crash and maintain survival space in the occupant compartment. Likewise, as crash speeds get very high, restraint systems such as airbags and safety belts cannot keep the forces on occupants below severe injury levels.
Speed influences the risk of crashes and crash injuries in three basic ways:
- It increases the distance a vehicle travels from the time a driver detects an emergency to the time the driver reacts.
- It increases the distance needed to stop a vehicle once the driver starts to brake.
- It increases the crash energy by the square of the speeds. For example, when impact speed increases from 40 to 60 mph (a 50 percent increase), the energy that needs to be managed increases by 125 percent.
For practical reasons, there are limits to the amount of crash energy that can be managed by vehicles, restraint systems, and roadway hardware such as barriers and crash cushions. The higher the speed, the higher the likelihood that these limits will be exceeded in crashes, limiting the protection available for vehicle occupants. To put this into perspective, note that the government runs crash tests for occupant protection at 30-35 mph — speeds considered to be severe impact speeds.
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Sister just save yourself now... before you have to dig yourself out of trouble... and follow the rules of the road... and encourage your friends to as well...
Florida Teen Driving Laws - MUST be your first set of rules...
http://www.flhsmv.gov/ddl/teendriv.html states (among other things)
With your Learner's License, you may:
Only drive during daylight hours during the first three months and until 10 p.m. thereafter, always with a licensed driver who is at least 21 years old and occupies the front passenger seat.
Intermediate License (16 and 17 year old) - To earn an operator's license, you must be at least 16 years old AND have held a learner's license for at least one year without any traffic convictions.
You must provide:
- A Florida Learner's License or a license from another jurisdiction.
- Parent or guardian certification that you have at least 50 hours of behind the wheel driving experience, of which 10 hours must be at night.
You are required to take:
- Driving test and perform certain driving maneuvers. Please refer to the Florida Driver Handbook for specifics or present a waiver from an accepted driver education course. You are required to have a current registration and insurance on the vehicle at the driving test.
With your Intermediate License, you may:
- 16 years old - only drive between 6 a.m. and 11 p.m., unless accompanied by a licensed driver who is at least 21 years old and occupies the front passenger seat, or you are traveling to or from work.
- 17 years old - only drive between 5 a.m. and 1 a.m., unless accompanied by a licensed driver who is at least 21 years old and occupies the front passenger seat, or you are traveling to or from work.
Driving is a Privilege - Don't Lose It
There are a number of infractions that can cause you to lose or restrict your driving privileges. The following are of particular interest to teen drivers.
- If you receive a moving traffic conviction while you have a Learner's License, the one year period you are required to hold your Learner's License will be extended for one year from the date of the conviction or until you are 18 years old, whichever happens first.
- If you receive 6 points on your driving record within a 12 month period, your driving privileges are automatically restricted to business purposes only for 12 months or until you are 18, whichever happens first. If you receive additional points during this restricted period, the restriction is extended 90 days for each additional point.
- If you have a blood alcohol level of .02% or more (applies to those under age 21), an administrative suspension of six months will result.
- If you are truant in your school attendance, your driving privilege is suspended until you provide proof you have attended school for 30 consecutive days.
- If you are convicted for possession of tobacco products (applies to those under age 18).
Driving Violations and Points
Speeding
Less than 15 mph over the speed limit
3 points
More than 15 mph over the speed limit
4 points
Speeding resulting in an crash
6 points
Moving Violation
Moving violation (includes driving during restricted hours and parking on a highway outside the limits of a municipality)
3 points
Moving violation resulting in a crash
4 points
Failing to stop at a traffic signal (effective October 1, 2005) 4 points Passing a stopped school bus 4 points Reckless driving
4 points
Leaving the scene of a crash resulting in property damage of more than $50 6 points Improper lane change 3 points Violation of a traffic control sign/device 4 points Open container as an operator 3 points Child restraint violation 3 points Littering
3 points
Point Value Table - Detail by FL Statute Driving Violation
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