Please Help... fellow crew not wearing SCBA

I am having a really hard time convincing my fellow firefighters to wear SCBA at a car fire...

i've seen a picture before that has a car exploding on a pair of firefighters with the words.... "this is why we should wear SCBA"

 

however... i've looked everywhere and cannot seem to find it. can someone please upload it to this discussion so i can put it all over the station. would be much appreciated.

 

i'm getting sick and tired of my fellow brothers acting like heroes. and i know it's gunna be me who ends up hurt cause of their mistake.

 

Thanks guys!

 

F/F Van Tilburg. Moe Urban Fire Brigade, VIC, Australia.

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Permalink Reply by Matthew van Tilburg on February 15, 2011 at 11:23pm
Thank you all for your valued input. i hope to get my concerns in their minds ASAP.

keep posting as the stuff i'm hearing is very helpful!!!
Permalink Reply by Marvin Hawk on February 16, 2011 at 2:17am
Permalink Reply by Mike Cox on February 16, 2011 at 5:12am
I'm reminded of a story....
One day a truck went under a low bridge and became stuck. All of the local officials were there with their years of 'expertice' and tried for hours to remove the truck. During that time a little girl tugged on the shirt sleeve of one of the officials and said "i know what to do." Because she was so small they continued to ignor her. Finally after hours and hours of failed attempts they listened to the little girl who said "why don't you let some of the air out of the tire. Then you can pull it out." There is more to the story but I'm trying to be brief. The point is, you don't have to be "a seasoned veteran" to point out the obvious!!

Years ago we didn't even have scba. New thinking provides new technology and hopefully safer firefighters.

Lad you keep right on trying to convince those "vets". One day they will listen.

Be Safe
Mike
Permalink Reply by James Wright on February 16, 2011 at 8:22am
NO you dont need no ones per. to talk about a safety issue
Permalink Reply by Mike "Lapo" Lapotasky on February 16, 2011 at 11:58am
Any of your crew members ever see a fellow brother battling espohageal or lung cancer, or any cancer for that matter? Do they think it makes them tough to not wear one? Why do they feel they don't need to wear one?
Where are you writing from?

The toxins in car fire smoke/gases are sometimes worse than those in common house fires (which are already beyond dangerous). Moreover, what could outweigh the risks enough to make that compromise?

My advice is to get them to realize their mistake or find another company. No offense, but its dumbasses like that who give the vollies a bad name. (I am guessing you are not on a paid crew becuse I somehow hope that all paid companies FORCE their guys to comply.

On the other hand, I blame your Chief and his line. No pack=no hose, PERIOD! Suspensions will put an end to that happy horse shit.
Permalink Reply by Mike "Lapo" Lapotasky on February 16, 2011 at 12:05pm
Why does his age have anything to do with it? Why do you subscribe to the thought model of "I have been doing this for years; I do what I want; my experience makes everything I say and do right; you're just a kid, you couldn't possibly know anything."

I agree that a certain amount of respect is due to veterans, and I agree that there is a time and place for a discussion like that, but to be plainly honest, years of experience does not give you carte blanche to just forego certain industry safety standards.

Stop using his newness and age as an excuse for people making dumbass decisions that NO veteran should make. if they are so damn knowledgable they should know better!

Matt...if I were you I would ignore this reply by "Jason"! Seriously.
Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on February 16, 2011 at 12:54pm
Matthew,

I was looking at the facebook link for your department - http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=367562227891&ref=ts#!/group.php?gid=367562227891&v=photos interesting thing, you have photos of (4) people at a trash fire at the back of a building, no one is even wearing SCBA. You have other photos that show a couple of FF's, on a hoseline spraying water into the front of a very much burning building, with no SCBA.

This, along with your post strongly suggests (to me) the following: You are in a department with a social club mentality (not surprising given that it's a volunteer department), little if any safety culture and possibly lacking much if anything in the way of mandatory qualifications to be an officer (your captain is NOT SCBA qualified, how can this possibly be?)

So on to your concerns. Given that you are both young and new there is little hope that you singularly will be able to change the culture of your department. In part because of your age/newness but also because (and I'd be willing to bet on this), it's the way they've always done it in your department.

I imagine that you going to whomever runs your department (Chief?) stands a good chance of stepping all over a number of toes, not the least of which may be your own Chief's. Failing your Chief doing anything about the situation you could go on to the State level and make a complaint there but again, you're (possibly) going against the current. And while many may agree that safety is important you might make some (very powerful) enemies along the way.

Your best options would be to either find another department or, do what you feel is in your best interest, safety wise. Should you be ordered to NOT wear SCBA at a car fire or any incident which you feel requires it, you may want to stick to your guns. Which of course means, if you're ordered to remove it and don't, you could be written up for disobedience. It is this last that may give you the opportunity to air your grievance(s) and push your department in the right direction. Of course, in doing so it could make you a pariah in your department and ultimately end up leaving, voluntarily or otherwise.

One final thought, I understand you looking for advice on how to deal with your situation but you should be aware that, quite likely you're not the ONLY one in your state, area or department that visits FFN. Pushing for safety in-house is one thing but holding your department up for public debate and criticism may not be in your own best interest. And one final sub-thought; have you tried with what ever passes as your chain of command? Oh an one more thing, how are you all with regards to using seat belts?
Permalink Reply by Jason on February 16, 2011 at 3:46pm
Given that you are both young and new there is little hope that you singularly will be able to change the culture of your department. In part because of your age/newness but also because (and I'd be willing to bet on this), it's the way they've always done it in your department.

I understand you looking for advice on how to deal with your situation but you should be aware that, quite likely you're not the ONLY one in your state, area or department that visits FFN. Pushing for safety in-house is one thing but holding your department up for public debate and criticism may not be in your own best interest.

That is exactly what I was getting at with my post without coming right out and saying it. Like I said when I first posted, no personal attack intended.
Some people read into things, jump to conclusions, and take things way out of context.
Permalink Reply by lutan1 on February 16, 2011 at 7:56pm
Ask them if they can spell LODD?
Permalink Reply by Matthew van Tilburg on February 16, 2011 at 7:58pm
yea im thinking to go speak to the officials. just gunna get all my facts together first.
Permalink Reply by Matt Tipper on February 17, 2011 at 1:32am
Matt,

It seems like the biggest issue here may be if they are not letting you wear the set. When I first started up a few years ago we never wore our sets at car fires but now we would always have at least one member in BA.

If these legends don't want to wear them you will not convince them and will propably make life harder for yourself trying. You can only help some people so much and then they're on their own. Too bad, so sad.

As long as you can wear it, just carry on....
Permalink Reply by Matthew van Tilburg on February 17, 2011 at 1:32am
Hi Jack/dt.

Thankyou heaps for your input, i am actually in those photos, in the dumpster photo i hadnt yet been qualified to wear SCBA, however in the shop fire, i was accredited to wear SCBA for about a month, the 3rd Lt of the brigade (Occupational Health and Safety Officer also) was the O.I.C. at this fire, i asked that "i'll put BA on". His reply "It's too late for BA" and to not put it on... i was dazed as to his response, but like a good young firefighter, i followed my officers orders. About 3 minutes later he told me to step back away from the shop to get out of the smoke???????? WTF!! Later into the firefight, i was asked by some other firefighters why i hadn't put BA on, and they were just as confused.

I dont understand how our Captain was able to be elected given the fact that he isn't qualified in a variety of basic firefighting skills, however we are volunteers so i kinda sympathise. It's painful to listen to him telling us (firefighters) how to fight the fires, as the Incident Controller, he should be "controlling the incident" yes??,,, well he seems to be more concerned about telling me (leaning over my shoulder) where to aim my branch than anything else??? It just frustrates me!!!

I can't move to another volunteer brigade, as this is the town i live in and serve, it would mean moving house. however i have just passed my final interview to become a recruit firefighter with the MFB in Melbourne. So by mid year i should be a full time career firefighter.

Thankyou for your input. and the advise on what to and what not to say on here.

We're pretty good with seatbelts, there was a bad smash involving a fire truck a few towns over not that long ago so we all wear them most of the time.

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