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Preconnect or Booster Reel?
I am a volunteer firefighter in rural georgia, and my department has always used our 1 1/2 preconnect as our primary attack lines. But while running mutual aid I have noticed other departments prefer to use booster line. I can see the convenience of booster line, its lighter, more maneuverable, and its a heck of alot easier to load on the truck. but on the other hand, you are sacrificing gallonage that may be necessary in the structure. I know each department is different, and have their own SOGs, so i would like to know what your SOGs say and what you prefer.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on
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Just a side note Capcity, are you familiar with East St. Louis, Ill.? They are a department that had 8 engines and 4 trucks and 4 or better person staffing back in the 60's but now has 3 or 4 engines with 3 people assigend to each. It is an old industrial city with serious problems. Their guys get working fires almost every day, this is in a city of about 50,000 people. Anyway their big deal is to hit the scene running, with preconnect in hand. Hitting the fire quick and hard. They have no ladder company anymore so they try to knock the fire quickly besore ventilation is needed. Tough situation but they run as well and are into the quick as posible knock down also.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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Most of our chimneys are new constructin metal flues inside a wooden chimney. If it gets out of the liner in those, it's a structural fire.
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Permalink Reply by David Earl Gregory on
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Thanks. The point of my story, and it is as true as I'm sitting here right now, was sometimes, no matter what you do, someone is gonna try second guessing. We're all guilty of it, myself included, especially those times when I was just an observer wondering why a particular local dept. was waiting for the fire to come to them instead of going after it? I agree things have changed dramatically since I was in. My last run was in 1985. I can still drive and I hope I could still pull a line and make an attack but with all the hazards of today, I'd better let the younger ones with up-to-date training go for it.
Tell you another good one on the same Chief. After I left that dept., they got a run for a brush/car fire at the back end of a local auto graveyard. Just so happened, it was owned by the head commissioner at the time. Well, my former Capt. was in the engine, (new ALF Century), and the brush truck was with them. Brush truck at that time was an old GI 3/4 ton weapons carrier, 4X4 with tank, pump, booster, etc. Capt. stopped the engine inside the junkyard short of the all the scrap metal and let the brush truck go after it. Chief ordered said Capt. to "Take that fire truck down in there!" Well, Capt. did as told and wound up puncturing a tire. Chief SUSPENDED said Capt. for 3 days for damaging the tire.
Yep, me too. W T F??????????????????? "IF" certain former colleagues of mine are on this forum, I'm sure they'll recognize EXACTLY who I'm referencing here. We had a great bunch of guys back then and one of them is now the Chief of that dept. I miss the old gang and haven't had an opportunity to go back and see who might still be there that I know.
Okay, strayed way the hell off the point here. In my opinion, the booster has it's place, yesterday, today, and tomorrow. Others will and have already disagreed. Free country last time I checked, y'all can do that here and we can still be friends. I hope. :-)
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Permalink Reply by Triple J on
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SERIOUSLY?!?!? I thought that we stopped using booster lines for making interior attacks 30 years ago. There's been too many close calls from not bringing in enough GPMs.
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Way back in the '60s and '70s high pressure fog was still in use by quite a few departments. The theory of steam conversion was good, but too many times it only pushed fire through the structure we were trying to save. There may be a few hold-outs out there, but high pressure booster lines have gone the way of the open cab.
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They are out there, even lines that will flow 250 GPM. I'm guessing the reason they are not popular is the weight and amount of space it takes on the Engine.
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Same for us.
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Permalink Reply by Lt. Jeremiah Kirk on
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In our small Oklahoma town we cover a wide variety of structures to heavy industrial facility's and I will not let my privates use the booster line on a structure or vehicle fire. we use 1.5" pre-connects on structure or other demied fire's occurding to our sog's. we do have an 100 ft of 1.5 line on the front bumper that we use on car fires and other small fires. we use our booster line for cleaning tools, wash downs on road ways or for cleaning the our boots before u step back into the rig. plain and simple if there is a question check the nfpa's guide lines for structural firefighting. more gpm a quicker knock down. and we want everyone to be safe and go home
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Permalink Reply by Matthew LaRock on
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As long as you tried your best to defend your actions thats all that really matters!
Heres a little story for you:
One night we get called to a residential smoke detector activation in a two unit townhouse. Activation was called in by the neighbor who woke up to it sounding. First engine rolls out with 5 on board. As we were responding the Officer said lets be ready for ANYTHING! each person was given an assignment, 1 person to lay the supply (if needed), I was going to be pulling the primary line with the officer and the other firefighter was going to be pulling the back-up line and having one of the guys on the tower meet-up to have a 2 person crew on the second line. We usually don't run residential fire alarms thats why we approached it as if we were going to have fire or signs of an active structural fire on arrival.
Needless to say when we arrived we had nothing showing. As we prepared to make entry. The neighbor met us stating that her car and the lights were on; meaning the dwelling was still occupid. Approached the door to find a pretty good smoke condition on the interior but could tell it was food on the stove. Entry was made and we found the resident sleeping on a couch; she was awoken (alittle starled) and was assisted out and eventually transported for smoke inhaltion.
10 more minutes and this would have been a working fire. pot of water on the stove had boiled down to nothing and their were contents all over the place. Luckly the neighbor heard the detector and called it in.
I know this is long, but the point is always be prepared even though we always go to the smells and bells where its usually nothing or food on the stove; you never know when its going to be the real thing.
Know your're probably wondering how in the heck does this relate to the above post, simple it all relates to being prepared. Were we prepared yes, we had a game plan; did we follow through yes- we may not have laid in or pulled the attack lines, but we were ready to. We went up to the front door with a ceiling hook, irons, TIC and Water can (This could open up a whole different can of worns!), point being conditions on arrival dicated not needing the line to be pulled. In my opinion it is ok to investigate with the mentioned tools.
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Permalink Reply by Sparky3317 on
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Preconnects usually 1 1/2 or 1 3/4 for the initial attack on a fire.
Myself I am always going to grab a preconnect on a fire.
But like stated before there are alot of departments that still use booster lines for initial attacks on house fires.
The following video is from Detriot Fire Department. The firefighter that does the initial interior attack on the first floor is using a booster line. Now they do have other lines in place making an attack on the second floor and through the first floor window. But once the firefighters are in place at the door the outside line stays committed to the second floor and the first floor fire is knocked down by a booster line.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Rr8bCATOeA
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Permalink Reply by Trevor Hawkins on
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thanks for replying sparky,
That was a great video, I understand pulling a booster if all of your preconnect is already commited to an attack. would i have swaped the 1 1/2 with the booster? yes, but that is just my personal prefrence. once again thank you for posting, have a safe and productive day.
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Permalink Reply by Marty Hrinko on
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Our old engine had a booster reel, and we only used it on engine compartment fires, rubbish fires, brush fire, room and content fires, or if there is a possiblity of an exposure problem.
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