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No Pay? No Play!
Here's another story of a homeowner who didn't pay the subscription fee for fire protection, believing that, if he had a fire, the fire department would come anyway.
He was wrong.
This follows the same line of thinking of districts who shut down their departments, believing that, if they needed fire protection, they could rely on mutual aid.
What is wrong with that thinking?
Read the story from Tennessee: http://www.wpsdlocal6.com/news/local/Firefighters-watch-as-home-bur...
TCSS.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Greenman on
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I don't care if they pay happily, or not. The law needs to be written so that property owners are compelled to pay the fire subscription fee.
Here's an idea: include the fire subscription fee in the ad valorum tax on the property, then it WILL get paid or there will be a lien on the property for back taxes.
While everyone "should" happily pay, it just shouldn't be an option when it comes to public safety. This can only be fixed by local and state legislation.
Greenman
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Permalink Reply by Vic Silverfish on
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Posting personal contact data for these guys? Stay classy, Cathy!
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I don't understand your dilemma. The home-owner made a conscious choice that he did not want fire protection. He already told you that your services were not needed. If he gave a good goddam, he'd have paid the fee. I for one would be pretty mad if I found out I risked my neck for this bozo and he'd been playing the department for chumps the whole time.
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Ben - very interesting. Thanks for the info.
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Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
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Cathy,
Are you suggesting that members of FFN contact these people to complain?
What would be your reasoning for that?
That an insurance rep and a risk manager recommended that the City NOT respond is not relevant, it was a decision made by the mayor of South Fulton. Furthermore, why would where the insurance rep live be relevant?
This link - http://troy.troytn.com/Obion%20County%20Fire%20Department%20Present...
The Obion County Fire Department
A Presentation Regarding The Establishment
And Implementation of a County-Wide Fire Department provides some interesting information.This report, dated March 2008 recommended the formation of a county-wide fire department. No action was taken. A comment from the presentation: "According to survey information, over 75% of all municipal fire department’s structure calls are rural. All fire departments in Obion County charge a $500.00 fee per call in rural areas, but collections are, less than 50% and the fire departments have no way of legally collecting the charge. Therefore, the service was provided at the expense of the municipal tax payer."
Given that "...over 75% of all municipal fire department’s structure calls are rural...", it would strongly suggest that the financial burden would fall on those taxpayers who actually pay their taxes. Expecting a minority of people to pay for fire protection for the majority defies belief. Especially when those without fire protection can actually have it with the payment of a very small subscription fee. But look at it from another point of view, should the residents of South Fulton (and the 7 other municipal departments) likewise provide health insurance for the county residents who don't have or choose not to purchase health insurance? After all, that too could be a life issue as well.
The issue in Obion County is an issue that residents in that county need to address, as opposed to a town-hall style meeting here in which people express their outrage. We are not responsible for those taxes and have no business dictating to those residents what they should or should not be doing.
The Presentation I supplied the link to clearly shows the risk and need, that it was not acted upon by the County Commissioners is the only relevant fact. That and the fact(s) that the home owner in question chose not to pay the tax and started the fire himself; "...after he started a fire in a couple of barrels in his backyard and the fire got out of control..." http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2010/10/firefighting-obion-county Careless AND cheap.
Another thought: When articles appear regarding fire department layoffs, brownouts and station closures the comments here are predicatable and in favor of the fire departments, yet when already financially burdened departments require pay-for-play for non-residents as a means to reduce a financial burden, the comments seem to then swing the other way and condemn the fire department. You can't have it both ways. Continued un-financed fire protection to county residents almost surely means that eventually the fiscal burden could involve laying off of firefighters in the departments responding to those non-contributing areas. Am I the only one that sees the irony here?
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Don't be too down on "Obama's" bailout. It seems to have not only worked better than expected, but cost us (taxpayers) next to nothing, and may even turn a profit.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/333426c2-cf1d-11df-9be2-00144feab49a,Author...
I put Obama in quotes because TARP (the bailout legislation) was passed in 2008 under Bush.
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Permalink Reply by John Dobson on
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Are fire dept is a business, It is owned by the firefighters not the taxpayers. We are a not-for-profit business but still a business. We are hired by Johnson township for fire protection.
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Permalink Reply by Karr Quintero on
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I have to agree with the subscription policy. if no life was in danger, the only thing to do is keep it contained.
bad enuff Volunteer departments recieve little to no comphensation, but why should a home owner who doesnt want to contribute to local emergancy services expect to recieve such services?
what would their insurance company say to this?
it was 75 bucks a year! thats like 20 cents a day approx.!
it's not blackmail or an impossed tax thats unfair, it's a insurance policy that our government should be responsible for but aint. so we are stuck with said policys in rural areas..
I wonder when we will start getting charged to call the police in such times?
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Permalink Reply by Phoenix on
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What about public relations.
They say they don't blame the firefighters but I guarantee you they are trashing them to everyone they speak to."Come look at my home...they just stood there and let it burn to the ground". Now the insurance company bares the brunt of this which will cause premiums to go up for everyone that has the same insurance as these folks have.
There is no way I could just stand by and watch someones home,belongings,ect. go up in flames over $75.00. I vollie at a very small rural FD and we depend on our community support like most others, we also have a subscription program but in no way, shape, or form would we ever let this happen, paid subscription or no paid subscription.
I don't recall if they said the company was a paid or vollie but I promise you, this will turn into a media firestorm(no punn intended) and a nightmare for this company. And to think the local government supports or encourages this manner of thinking.....maybe that community should rethink who they put in office. I know that's somewhere I wouldn't want to live or raise a family.
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In a muncipal fire department funded by municipal taxes, the dispertion of which is approved by the local government, how then can a fire chief dictate to that governing body how those funds are used?
If your department has a subscription service but supposedly would respond to those that don't subscribe, why bother with the subscription in the first place? Moreover, being volunteer, if your community doesn't care that they carry the burden for others that's a decision they're comfortable with. In South Fulton, the fire department is funded by residents in the city of South Fulton through their local taxes and THEIR mayor has decided that to be fiscally responsible, county residents must pay or they are NOT protected. It is an issue that those county residents need to resolve through their county commissioners. Maybe if you look at the links I included in an earlier response it would make more sense. Or maybe not.
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True, I couldnt just not respond and I am fully confident in saying our departnent would go and do what we can for a non-subscriber. But if no life was in danger and it was fully involved, we would only just contain it. Im verry upset on their mayors actions, and dont understand why they couldnt just bill them somehow? were they trying to set an example?
I left my post sounding like I was a stickler to policy, but community comes first! thats why I joined the department.
I cant belive they didnt rush out to account for all the residents of that structure! our EMR policy is differnt then fire, and this falls under both in a way.
community support is very important, funding is nessisary, but where does one draw the line?
this should have NEVER happend....
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Super Heroes don't charge for their services to their community but then, maybe they feel it's incumbent upon them to offer their services free of charge in exchange for their having super powers. I for one don't see any correlation to super heroes and firemen. But that's just me.
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