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Cops vs. Fire fighters
This pastr week I was on spring break & had the chance to run calls with my volunteer fire station. We had several calls on one day. The first was a structure fire at 0500 in the morning. It was a perfect scene when it came to interstaion cooperation and communication. The problem was the county sheriffs deputies passing several engines on their way to the scene and running a few responders in their POVs off the road. Later that day around 10 pm we had a drunk hit a power pole. We were toned out and when I arrived on scene a deputy almost hit my vehicle & he had run a fellow responder off the narrow road. Then the deputy jumped through live wires & pulled the victim out of the vehicle. Do any of yall have this kind of problem with the law enforcement officers in your areas? Are they cooperative or are they like the ones in mine?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by AAAAAA on
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Some cops just don’t get it. It is just like the cop trying to give us a parking ticket for parking a fire truck in the fire lane at the hospital picking up are medic from a call.
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Permalink Reply by Rescuefrog on
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We get along pretty well with the cops in our small city, even with the deputies that come to assist. Most are friends away from the departments as well as within. It probably helps that we share a building and also a bay in the winter. We have fundraisers together ie:(special olympics), picnics and play a Hogs and Hosers softball game the end of summer. We even have a trophy that has a fire hose with handcuffs that goes to the winning team. Reach out- have a get to know your responders barbeque, you'd be surprised how the smallest gesture can help bring you together.
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Permalink Reply by Daniel Chewning on
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we have a suprisingly good relationship with our counties law enforcement at our volunteer department....this is probably due to the fact that our fire chief is a sergent sherrif so we know most of the law enforcement in our county...on any calls we go on they will come to us and ask us what we need them to do...one night we had a working fire right of our busy highway and they were there quick to block off traffic and diverting them for us....but it is ridiculous that they are running responders off and passing trucks cause they really cant do anything once they get there specially on a structure fire..
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Permalink Reply by Walter on
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I've been on both sides of the spectrum, law enforcement and fire. Still am. It all depends on the indv. some police stand back and let us do our thing, others dont. One call i had was a MVC with possible entrapment. When i arrived about a block from the scene county had the street shut down. I approached them and said im with the fire dept. can i get through to my guys. I showed him my id and he said NO! The scene was closed to traffic i told him again i was with the FD he still said no. I told my Asst chief and he said he would take care of it. Ever since, i have never had county prevent me form responding to the scene.
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Permalink Reply by Dennis Hale on
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Where I run we're usually waiting on the cops to get there so we don't really have a problem with the cops because we've already been on scene for 5 or 10 minutes before they get there.
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Permalink Reply by Leslie Barker on
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OMG!!! I hate cops with a passion!!! Especially small town ones who think they are tough u know what!!! I know the Indiana cops have a problem with thinking we are insuperior to them or something and they start trying to tell us how to do our job. Umm if i'm not mistaken they where the ones who called us for assistance therefore shut up and go fill out your paper work while I save a life ok!!!! Woooo glad I got that off my chest!!!! lol
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Permalink Reply by Rod Strickland on
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Trey, you got it boy....Your Chief
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Permalink Reply by Jim on
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Our county has always been praised about the way all 4 LE agencies, Fire and EMS work together. My question is do you respond to the scene in your POV's? Anytime you are in a POV whether you have lights or not you must yeild to marked responding vehicles. At least that is how it is here. One of the problems we have with responding to the scene in a POV is it congests the area with unneeded vehicles that cause more of a hazard than it helps. The best way of bettering relations between the agencies is to have the brass talk. If that doesn't help, then make an effort to communicate witht eh officers and deputies you work with. I agree that passing the engines is not advisable, but most of our LE's will follow us to the scene knowing there is not much they can do. You always have a few bad apples, but most know there limitations. If there is bad blood between the agencies there is usually a reason. Be the first to extend the hand and you will be surprised how fast that changes the attitudes.
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Permalink Reply by Trey Taylor on
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We do respond in our POVs, there are several reasons why, 1. our engines only carry 2-3 perrsonell at a time, 2. the distance from the station that personell live in, 3. many times it is quicker to respond due to the distance from the call, & the fact that by the time you get to the station the truck has already rolled. We had the same problem with POVs congesting the firegrounds, but we have solved that by everyone parking away from the scene, with the exception of the first members on scene if they beat the truck. When I respond I give way to the offical emergency vehicles, I assume most do to. When I left home the paid county fire chief and the sheriffs office were sopposed to be working out this situation, so hopefully things will get like in some of yalls areas.
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Permalink Reply by Chris Coulson on
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I am on both sides of this discussion as previously being a deputy sherriff and now being a paramedic and volunteer firefighter. The thing that I always tried to remember was who knows more about taking command of the scene. If it was an assault or domestic law enforcement should be first in... If it is a wreck as you described with live power lines, unless you are sure you or your pt. cant be hurt fire/ems should be in first... if you or they can be injured how about letting entergy crews in first... If there is a fire how about letting the FD go in first... Sorry to be so simplistic but common sense goes along way and keeps more people from being hurt! In my area police are Horrible about being lazy and not doing there job so I cant really relate with them trying to pass us! However in the county our deputies are great and we have an excelent relationship with them all. If I were one of the responders that was pushed off the road I would have a long discussion with my Fire Chief and have them try to get the problem resolved with higher ranking local law enforcement officals.
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Permalink Reply by Greenman on
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I have to admit I see some good from LEOs getting to the scene quickly, even ahead of the engines.
LEOs can secure the scene, stop traffic, and all of the "Cop stuff" they do, making our arrival that much quicker and better from the start. Let's face it, a squad car can get to the scene much faster than our apparatus, and by getting there two or three minutes ahead of us can mean the difference between one victim in the house and two, or three in the house. How many Moms, Dads, Brothers and Sisters, even Babysitters run back into a burning house to attempt to rescue a loved one? Sometimes the Cops get bitten by the "Stupid bug" and go in too, but if they do their job and secure those at the scene outside it makes our primary search that much quicker and safer!
Referencing the Video Web Chief posted in "Civilian Drivers, or confused idiots," there are idiots who will drive through a scene without regard to victims, firefighters or good Samaritans. How many MVAs have you seen where drivers just go around the wrecked vehicle without one thought of waiting out of the way, or ...heaven forbid...providing first aid until we arrive? The Police can shut-down that down and make our arrival that much safer!
I think the key to answering the age-old question "Can't we all just get along?" is what the Army calls "Combined Arms Training." In the Army no one type of Soldier, or unit, ever acts alone, so Army units practice training together so they work as a single team. Infantry trains with Armor, who trains with artillery, who trains with cavalry, who train with...well you get my drift.
Do Fire Departments ever include Police units in their burn training? In extrication training?
Maybe if we started including scenarios at the training facility where the first units on-scene were cruisers instead of engines? Then LEOs would get used to seeing fire, smelling smoke and doing THEIR job in THAT environment and the "Hero Reflex" would be tamed.
Just my 2¢.
GM
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The problem Trey is talking about is all about safety. I was at that scene and was scene commander. First of all we were told of trappage and power lines down. Who needs to be there first. When we called en-route, I had dispatch notify the power co. The deputy didn't need to get there first except for traffic control, and keep bystanders away from power lines. He definately did NOT need to go through 3 hot 7200 volt powere lines, let alone move the patient out of the vehicle. Two could have died. When I told him to get away from the lines he cursed me. That ain't going to happen, especially when I have been to hundreds of these tipes of incidents. We have been haveing meetings with our sheriff about these types of situations. I agree that there are times when LEO needs to be there first. We have a good working tenure, and have deputies that are involved in our fire service. You get a youngster every now and then, and we've all done stupid things, but not with electricity...You don't get a second chance being stupid around electricity....This problem has been addressed with the Sheriff. You know we are all brothers in one sence or the other. We take care of each other on or away from scenes. I tell all of my people not to get excited unless you see me get excited. God bless you all..
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