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9/11 Families Divided Over Mosque, Community Center
SAMANTHA GROSS
Associated Press Writer
NEW YORK - Talat Hamdani traveled to Mecca to pray that her missing son, an EMT, was safe in the days after 9/11. She held out hope that his Muslim background had led to his detention as a suspect, considering it better than the alternative.
(AP Photo/Bebeto Matthews)
Related
New York City Commission Opens WTC Site for Mosque Construction
When part of his body was returned to her - his lower half shattered into 34 pieces - it was final proof he had indeed been killed when Islamic extremists brought down the World Trade Center. As Americans take sides over plans to build an Islamic cultural center and mosque blocks away, Hamdani says it feels personal.
"Why are we paying the price? Why are we being ostracized? Our loved ones died," she said at her Lake Grove, N.Y., home. "America was founded on the grounds of religious freedom," and opposition to the cultural center "is un-American. It's unethical. And it is wrong."
The thousands of relatives of the 2,976 victims have no single representative and no unified voice, even as another 9/11 anniversary approaches. The conflict is dividing a group that in many ways has never been united, with some saying the cultural center would reopen old wounds too close to hallowed ground and others say that opposing it is tantamount to bigotry.
And some, like Vandna Jain, walk a middle ground.
"It is unfair to persecute the group, however, in turn, there should be some respect for the feelings of the people that are forever attached to this site due to their losses," the New City, N.Y., resident, whose father, Yudh, died in the north tower, wrote in an e-mail. "I think people have a right to be upset about it, just as much as people have a right to build a mosque."
Jim Riches, a former New York Fire Department deputy chief whose son, Jimmy, was killed at the trade center, believes the dispute has nothing to do with religious freedom.
"We're not telling them not to practice their religion. ... It's about location, location, location," he said, asking why the mosque couldn't be built farther away from the land that he still considers a cemetery. "It's disrespectful. You wouldn't put a Japanese cultural center at Pearl Harbor."
Liza Murphy feels differently. Her brother, Charlie, died at ground zero, but she says she doesn't lay claim to the sprawling, 16-acre site.
"It's a place where a terrible tragedy took place, but I don't see what makes it sacred," said the Brooklyn resident. "Nine years later, that now belongs to the public. And my brother and his death are private and belong to me."
Murphy says she has no objection to the planned mosque and wouldn't want to judge one group of Muslims based on the actions of another.
But Peter Gadiel says he owes no apologies for singling one group out. Since his son, James, was killed at the trade center, Gadiel has argued publicly that all Muslims should share some collective guilt for what happened on 9/11.
"The fact is that Islam does not coexist well with other religions, and you can't separate that from Islam," the Kent, Conn., resident said, explaining his stand against the mosque. "If that sounds intolerant on my part, that's too bad."
The families' impassioned responses to the prospect of the mosque have influenced the public debate.
Gov. David Paterson has suggested moving the project further away from the trade center site out of respect for opponents' feelings, while Mayor Michael Bloomberg came out in support of the mosque, calling it a test of the separation of church and state.
President Barack Obama has said he believes Muslims have the right to build the Islamic center as a matter of religious freedom, though he's also said he won't take a position on whether they should actually build it.
The imam leading plans for the center on Friday called extremism a security threat in both the West and the Muslim world. Feisal Abdul Rauf made his comments to Associated Press Television News in Bahrain during a Mideast tour funded by the U.S. State Department, but he wouldn't discuss the uproar over the Islamic center.
Relatives of those slain on Sept. 11 have made their diverging voices heard on a number of issues over the years _ from whether to try the suspects in a civilian court to the location of a proposed freedom museum at ground zero that is no longer planned for the site.
Charles Wolf, who lost his wife, Katherine, at the trade center, says emotions among family members are especially raw right now.
"This is anniversary season. It's really, really hard," the Manhattanite said. "Passions are up and this is bringing up a lot of hurt in people."
He says he worries that any decision to respond to public pressure and move the mosque would be used by extremists to paint Americans as intolerant.
"The powers of evil were piloting those airplanes," he said of the Sept. 11 attackers.
Now, with the mosque dispute, "here is where we're falling into the terrorists' trap ... trying to tear each other apart. Good people fighting other good people - does that sound like evil at work?"
___
Associated Press writers David B. Caruso and Karen Matthews in New York and Martha Raffaele in Philadelphia contributed to this report.
Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
Associated Press Writer
NEW YORK - Talat Hamdani traveled to Mecca to pray that her missing son, an EMT, was safe in the days after 9/11. She held out hope that his Muslim background had led to his detention as a suspect, considering it better than the alternative.
(AP Photo/Bebeto Matthews)
Related
New York City Commission Opens WTC Site for Mosque Construction
When part of his body was returned to her - his lower half shattered into 34 pieces - it was final proof he had indeed been killed when Islamic extremists brought down the World Trade Center. As Americans take sides over plans to build an Islamic cultural center and mosque blocks away, Hamdani says it feels personal.
"Why are we paying the price? Why are we being ostracized? Our loved ones died," she said at her Lake Grove, N.Y., home. "America was founded on the grounds of religious freedom," and opposition to the cultural center "is un-American. It's unethical. And it is wrong."
The thousands of relatives of the 2,976 victims have no single representative and no unified voice, even as another 9/11 anniversary approaches. The conflict is dividing a group that in many ways has never been united, with some saying the cultural center would reopen old wounds too close to hallowed ground and others say that opposing it is tantamount to bigotry.
And some, like Vandna Jain, walk a middle ground.
"It is unfair to persecute the group, however, in turn, there should be some respect for the feelings of the people that are forever attached to this site due to their losses," the New City, N.Y., resident, whose father, Yudh, died in the north tower, wrote in an e-mail. "I think people have a right to be upset about it, just as much as people have a right to build a mosque."
Jim Riches, a former New York Fire Department deputy chief whose son, Jimmy, was killed at the trade center, believes the dispute has nothing to do with religious freedom.
"We're not telling them not to practice their religion. ... It's about location, location, location," he said, asking why the mosque couldn't be built farther away from the land that he still considers a cemetery. "It's disrespectful. You wouldn't put a Japanese cultural center at Pearl Harbor."
Liza Murphy feels differently. Her brother, Charlie, died at ground zero, but she says she doesn't lay claim to the sprawling, 16-acre site.
"It's a place where a terrible tragedy took place, but I don't see what makes it sacred," said the Brooklyn resident. "Nine years later, that now belongs to the public. And my brother and his death are private and belong to me."
Murphy says she has no objection to the planned mosque and wouldn't want to judge one group of Muslims based on the actions of another.
But Peter Gadiel says he owes no apologies for singling one group out. Since his son, James, was killed at the trade center, Gadiel has argued publicly that all Muslims should share some collective guilt for what happened on 9/11.
"The fact is that Islam does not coexist well with other religions, and you can't separate that from Islam," the Kent, Conn., resident said, explaining his stand against the mosque. "If that sounds intolerant on my part, that's too bad."
The families' impassioned responses to the prospect of the mosque have influenced the public debate.
Gov. David Paterson has suggested moving the project further away from the trade center site out of respect for opponents' feelings, while Mayor Michael Bloomberg came out in support of the mosque, calling it a test of the separation of church and state.
President Barack Obama has said he believes Muslims have the right to build the Islamic center as a matter of religious freedom, though he's also said he won't take a position on whether they should actually build it.
The imam leading plans for the center on Friday called extremism a security threat in both the West and the Muslim world. Feisal Abdul Rauf made his comments to Associated Press Television News in Bahrain during a Mideast tour funded by the U.S. State Department, but he wouldn't discuss the uproar over the Islamic center.
Relatives of those slain on Sept. 11 have made their diverging voices heard on a number of issues over the years _ from whether to try the suspects in a civilian court to the location of a proposed freedom museum at ground zero that is no longer planned for the site.
Charles Wolf, who lost his wife, Katherine, at the trade center, says emotions among family members are especially raw right now.
"This is anniversary season. It's really, really hard," the Manhattanite said. "Passions are up and this is bringing up a lot of hurt in people."
He says he worries that any decision to respond to public pressure and move the mosque would be used by extremists to paint Americans as intolerant.
"The powers of evil were piloting those airplanes," he said of the Sept. 11 attackers.
Now, with the mosque dispute, "here is where we're falling into the terrorists' trap ... trying to tear each other apart. Good people fighting other good people - does that sound like evil at work?"
___
Associated Press writers David B. Caruso and Karen Matthews in New York and Martha Raffaele in Philadelphia contributed to this report.
Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Shareef Abdu Nur on
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Most of the members of this website know me as a Persian Gulf War veteran, Firefighter, Fire Officer, Truck Officer, Training Officer, husband, father, brother, and/or Paramedic. I am also a Muslim and yes, my religion is that of Islam. I have been a Muslim for well over 15 years. This does not make me anywhere near an authority on Islam or world religions, but i speak from a different point of view than most of you here.
First and foremost, I would like to sincerely thank all of you who stand for freedom, democracy, and equality and stand against ignorance, prejudice, racism, and bigotry. It gives me a warm fuzzy feeling to know that after all of the "pulling together" and "embracing one another" that we pretended to do after 9/11, that in 2010 we are still knee deep in ignorance, fear, and prejudice.
Being an African American male, I face prejudice and racism to some degree each and every day. At one point of my Fire Service career, I honestly and naively believed that the Fire Service put "brotherhood" first and our own fears 2nd, 3rd, if at all. But, to my own dismay, I have been proven wrong again. Even after all that we, as a nation, have been through from our inception throughout slavery, civil war, civil rights, terrorists attacks, world wars, etc...there are still the masses who believe, "Same but separate."
We, in the Fire Service should start walking what we talk and practicing what we preach! We need to walk away from fear and ignorance, educate ourselves, and make clear rational decisions based on facts and not fiction. We should stop jumping on anyone's band wagon and establish ourselves as the honorable and distinguished service that we once were.
I am open to any discussion or questions about our religion, but if anyone on this site has never asked me a question or voiced a concern or desire to know, than ignorance remains the dish of the day. Yes, the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11 claimed to be Muslims and yes they claimed to be attacking in the name of Islam. I'll say it again, they were misguided, misled, and miseducated extremists and we can not hold an entire 1/3 of the world's religious community acountable for the unfortunate misdirection of a small minority. Their greatest trial will be with the One true God and judge of all mankind. For us as Muslims, it is not about the building, it is about tolerance, bigotry, equality, and education.. It is not the fact, that we are not allowed to build an Islamic Center, but the fact that we are still all considered to be terrorists and that the American ideals of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness fall by the wayside when someone or some group does not fit the cookie cutter image of acceptance. Please forgive me for the rant, but ignorance is contagious and we can stop the spread of the disease right now and right here with simple open minded communication.
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Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on
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Brandon, have you not read any of the discussion?
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Shareef, thank you for that. Racism is the great American cancer that seems to have no cure. Our Nation is filled with its hatred, meaness and spitefullness. I wish there was a way to rid our Nation of this sad sickness but it seems hopeless. I will say this though, I have seen the fire service breach the gap at times, I guess that gives me some hope.
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Permalink Reply by lutan1 on
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It is not the fact, that we are not allowed to build an Islamic Center, but the fact that we are still all considered to be terrorists and that the American ideals of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness fall by the wayside when someone or some group does not fit the cookie cutter image of acceptance.
And unfortunately that is very evident in some of the responses here... :-(
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Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
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When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.
When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.
Friedrich Gustav Emil Martin Niemöller
The sensitivity that is bandied about is nothing more than a contrived conservative talking point designed, as they often are, to be divisive and polemical. I have little doubt that there is any desire on the part of those most loudly claiming sensitivity for there to actually be sensitivity.
This is a well crafted wedge-issue first brought about by political commentators whose trade-in-craft are exactly those kind of wedge issues. Had those in a position to be heard been straight and fair about it and simply said that the muslims that wanted to build were not the muslims that killed and that as citizens they too had all the same rights as everyone else in this country, had all politicians been united and clear that it was NOT an issue it wouldn't have become one.
Instead, those in a position to be heard said exactly the opposite. Cries of insensitivity were raised. But the message that got through wasn't about sensitivity, it was about how terrorists want to build a victory mosque on ground zero. Read public comments on the issue, most are not of the 'sensitive' kind.
The desire wasn't (and still isn't) for there to be understanding and acceptance of muslims, rather it was to suggest many things, not the least of which was that our own president might be (or is, depending with whom you speak) a muslim. And by suggesting THAT clearly implied that being a muslim IS bad. And if being a muslim is bad then 'they can not be allowed to build a victory mosque at ground zero'. Oh sure, some will say that is not the point, that while they have the legal right to build their 'mosque' it is insensitive of them to do so. So while John McCain refuses to apologize for referring to Vietnamese as "gooks" he has become the spokesman for all issues sensitive.
The argument was begun and encouraged by those who stood the most to gain in political traction or listeners/ratings but it had nothing to do with sensitivity. If those pushing the issue were really that sensitive, how is it we still have racism in this country. If sensitivity really were the issue, why is health care for everyone denied, if sensitivity really were the issue, why were false claims made about 'death panels', if sensitivity really were the issue why would those whom "God" made differently be denied the same rights as everyone else?
Sensitivity be damned; it's a political issue, it's a religious issue and it's a racist issue. Loud booming voices may decree otherwise but their attempts to derail any and all discussion of the real issues by plaintively insisting 'it's about sensitivity, dumbass' show them for the mean spirited and small minded people they really are. To many and too often, equality under the law is seen as a movable point that can adjusted left or right as it suits one's politics.
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Permalink Reply by WestPhilly on
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Jack,
As a blanket statement, which is what it is, your post is complete bullshit.
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WP,
I wrote something that was my opinion.
You responded with your opinion.
You thought my opinion was 'complete bullshit.'
I think the same about yours.
I'd say that makes us about even.
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I thought the blanket statement character of your post was complete bullshit, not your opinion.
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There you go again - more bullshit.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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Luke, I've said repeatedly that the Muslims have the right to build a mosque, community center, or whatever on the property they own.
When the response is "well, they have the right" that's not responsive to what was actually said.
Rights are not the issue, at least not with me. (This is the place where Jack may jump in and tell us how he knows what I'm thinking better than I do, but if he did that, he'd be wrong...again.)
Luke, you've had enough discussion with me about the senstivity issue that you should know better to try to redefine this as being about "rights" in a response to one of my posts.
I question your "World Police" characterization, unless you're re-defining "the World" as being the southern portion of Manhattan Island, since that is where the property in question is located.
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