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Black turn outs and safety
What color of turnouts do you use and why. I can't imagine using black because if I go down in a fire, It will be harder to find in black.Yes , I get you have the pass device but sometimes hearing where the sound is coming from in the comotion is hard.I prefer the normal tan color.I clean mine after every fire.Be safe and God Bless all of you.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Ray Edwards on
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I am glad to see or read all the differant comments on this subject.As I stated,we are American and all have our opinions.I think the black looks great. It is easier to keep it looking clean.My issue is being sean if down in a smoke filled room with a tic and on scene of mva's.Yes , there are usually alot of flashing lights but this creates a safety issue when the lights blind someone or as we all know what it does to drunk drivers.I respect everyones opinion.This is what this is about.God bless you all and Be Safe.Lets make 2009 and the rest of 2008 the safest year for all firefighters.We all have to watch each other.
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Permalink Reply by Mitch on
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These guys got it right! Their color coordinated with the flames………….well except for you know who in his navy blue gear.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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Why would you want to hide the dirt...and other stuff that gets in your gear? I realize we can't wash our gear after every call. As a hazmat tech, I understand the carcinogens, toxins, and other bad stuff that gets into our gear - stuff I don't want to keep around. If our gear is contaminated, but it's a dark color so we can't see it, aren't we really lying to ourselves and our brothers/sisters whose health and well-being we're supposed to be looking out for?
As for how much more heat we're absorbing in dark gear, I don't know if it's ever been measured. We know that black gear absorbs more radiant heat than yellow or tan, and ANY unnecessary heat is too much, with heat being the #1 cause of LODDs. Every little bit helps.
I understand tradition, but we finally got rid of lots of other traditions that killed us in obvious ways - riding tailboard or in open cabs, rubber coats, plastic helmets, running into big fires with small hoselines, breathing smoke, and bragging about how we used to be the most dangerous profession. Maybe it's time to let black gear go the same way.
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How about May 6, 1975?
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No wonder it takes so long to bake pumpkin pie. Orange must not absorb any heat at alll. :-)
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Clemants - what is the scientific basis for his "tests and drills"? What does he mean by "protection". Is that the same thing as minimizing heat stress on the firefigher?
Young - starts out with the qualifier "in most cases", adds the limit "smoke-filled room" and doesn't address a lot of real-world conditions. He further qualifies this by saying "most" of the shell heating is controlled by the inner compartments.
Bonamer - his statement is just an opinion, and it has similar qualifiers to Young's statement.
Freese - addresses comfort and performance, doesn't address heat stress at all.
Carpentier - "We do not feel..." in other words, it's just his opinion.
Parker - this one may have been science-based, but it's not clear - he didn't cite the science. He did refer to thermal protection ratings. Those ratings are not a measure of total heat stress, however.
Henry - Has "not seen any studies" that indicate that the wearer's core temp is raised. To what studies does she refer? What were the test conditions? How long did the tests last? Where were the temperatures measured? Did they use manikins, real people, were the people engaged in work or just sitting in a burn room, or what? Did the test conditions replicate a full range of ambient and fireground conditions, or did they just replicate on specific environmental type? Durability and protection are important, but they're not as important as the total heat stress on the wearer.
DiGiovanni - ventures an opinioun, cites not studies or methodology.
Granger - Ventures an opinion, cites no science.
My point is that unless a wide range of real-life conditions are replicated, even the gear manufacturers don't know exactly what the cumulative heat stress is on the firefighters under real-life conditions. That includes length of the burn tests, proximity, smoke conditions, working wrecks in bright sunlight, and a variety of other conditions.
Most importantly, only one of the quotes in the article makes any mention of firefighter core temp as a measure of protection, and that one doesn't address several of the other variables. Without that evidence, a lot of those quotes may very well fall into the category of "sales pitch".
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Permalink Reply by BillySFCVFD on
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Well said Ben. All those quoted did sound like marketing ploys and beating around the bush.
Everyone, accounting for any condition, except in front of similar or opposite colored backgrounds, and during the majority of the time, what's more visible, black or other options? It's simply science that everyone has experimented with when we look, scan and observe in every day life and on the job. Not arguing a point as much as wanting a reasonable answer. TCSS
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Permalink Reply by Barbara Nelson on
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We have the tan turnouts another district has the black ones. When you are in a fire it is usually so dark with smoke I really don't think that the color of our turnouts make that much of a difference. What you will see is the reflective tape on the coat and pants. Also you may have a T.I.C and that color makes no difference either. The only thing I don't care for with the black turnouts is the fact that they fade. Just my 2 cents. Barb
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We have a district in our dispatch area that went to the black turn outs, the biggest thing i noticed is that they fade really bad. They are almost more gray then black. But it does still have the reflective tape on on them. I did not know that they heat up faster though. That would be a safety issue with me. I have been in some pretty hot fires and I would not like to think that I was not protected as well as I could be. We have the globe G Extream turnouts. I like them. They don't show the dirt as bad either.
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Permalink Reply by Ethan Crichton on
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My department uses black. It def. does hide the dirt and everything else but that is a safety issue. I want to wash mine as I know it is very dirty but don't know how to go about that. Just separate the layers and wash in a normal washer? I read the tags but they didnt make sense. Someone help me here? PM me about it.
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Ethan,
The labels in your coat and pants should include basic directions for how to clean the gear.
One of the traditional reasons for purchasing black gear is that it hides soot, dirt, and other contaminents. As many of us previously stated here, one of the best reasons for lighter-colored gear is that it shows when the gear is contaminated and shows you when you need to clean it.
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