Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by John on July 1, 2008 at 9:36am

I think it is wrong for him to do that, our SOP states that if the apparatus has left to cut the ER, but in your situation where you have more than one in the bay and need the station manned I think it is OK to continue in on ER.

Permalink Reply by Jennica Stout on August 5, 2008 at 10:56pm

I agree with John...with more than one truck in the bay, he can't say a thing. He's interfering with a response and shouldn't be.
Your trustees will hopefully handle that quickly, it could harm someone in the future. There are smaller township dept's on Ohio that forbid POV response, but if your not one he was way out of line.

Permalink Reply by Joe Reams on August 18, 2008 at 7:55pm

In our SOG, all firefighters are to respond code 3 until the second truck is out on the road. I could understand if the firefighter was driving recklessly going 80 mph down a 35 mph road. Not pointing anyone out, but I've seen someone from our department going down the road far beyond the speed limit and blow through a red light. On the other hand, it should be a priority to get to the station as "safley as possible" to man the station and hop on a truck.

Permalink Reply by John on August 20, 2008 at 1:52pm

I agree with Joe going recklessly down the road is not the way to do it, Our Dept. states 10 over the posted limit with due gaurd for safety.

Permalink Reply by Jack Linthwaite on August 23, 2008 at 8:16pm

in our county the sheriff has no juriditction over responding fireifghters to the station with lights and siren, so long as we are doing it safely and our sog state following traffic laws such as going slow through or stopping at intersections before proceeding. we have had deputies block driveways with their cars when we get there with the truck for a fire. they get in the way becuase they don't understand our function vs theirs.

Permalink Reply by John on August 25, 2008 at 9:38am

That is so true, we had a fire last August and our Batallion told PD to shut the road down and they were like "which one" He had to tell them the whole intersection. They just don't know what our function is.

Permalink Reply by Fireman1274 on August 26, 2008 at 11:30pm

check out this post from a coworker of mine on this subject...

http://www.firefighternation.com/group/northwestohiofirefighters/fo...

Permalink Reply by Jack Linthwaite on September 2, 2008 at 7:29pm

here us some new information. one of our Captain,s just completed a train the trainer driving coarse for firefighters. The one thing they are teaching is that when crossing a 2 lane or multiple lane road the truck or vehicle is required to stop before proceeding across the next lane. the reason for this is a squad was responding and crossing a multiple lane road and hit another vehicle and the squad driver was sighted for the accident because he had not stopped befor entering the next lane. I know this will cause a lot of discussion as it did with our department when we discussed it.

Permalink Reply by John on September 3, 2008 at 8:51am

Our SOP states we are supposed to stop at intersections before proceeding through them to make sure the traffic sees us. We have had many people in our area that flat out do not stop when we approach an intersection or will not pull over when we come up from behind, It drives us all crazy.

Permalink Reply by united 289..{Dave} on October 19, 2008 at 12:53pm

As long The emergency exsits we are to respond 27 [eme traffic] traffic within reasonable safe manner rather to the actual scene or the station. Now what do you consider emergency still exsits. If you are responding to a scene and we already have personal and app on scene you are to back off and respond 29 traffic [non-eme] or untill you are told that the eme is under control. most if not all my men hve radios.

Permalink Reply by Donald on October 29, 2008 at 10:24am

Sounds like the typical "I am the sherrif and you will do as I say" situation. We have one of those in Guernsey County as well, so on that note I feel for you.
Question: did your guy give you the whole story or just the part about being stopped?

Typically (I am not on any ones side here, just the side of right) there are two sides to every story and both make the telling party look better than they were. If your guy was driving unsafe (we all know who determines that) then maybe the sherrif was correct.

Permalink Reply by Rob on January 12, 2009 at 4:25am

Time to chime in here...

Some may not like what I will say, but before you judge read it, look at policy, look at ORC, and think about saving your biscuts in a civil suit.

In the State of Ohio an emergency responder, in a vehicle that has been inspected and has the required sticker affixed from the State Fire Marshall's Office MAY respond lights AND siren to a true emergency. Pure staffing reasons woudl not justify an emergency response. If the second squad was needed for the call, that is a different story all together, keep it lit and roll on. If you know the squad that was dispatched has went enroute and you are only responding to stand by at the station to staff the second squad, there is not a true emergency. If you are responding with lights and siren activated, and you are involved in a collision (regardless of who's fault) and it is determined you were not responding to a true emergency you could be cited by the cops, and will loose in a civil suit. How much time does er vs non-er really gain you? If you live in the distance of the station that you would be responding to a dispatch on a true emergency, and you are now on the road (already closer, already awake, already dressed, already in the car) is it really a bad thing to continue non-er unless you get a dispatch?

As for the sherrif's deputy pulling your guy over, I can see his concern but disagree with his method of delivery. As for the deputy not having jurisdiction over vehicles on an emergency response, absolutely not true! They do very much have the ability to enforce ORC on persons responding in private or department vehicles on an emergency response. At the same time, woudl I stop if on a legitt er response for the deputy, absolutely not. I would have proceeded to the station and the on to the call and we would have discussed it later. Your department may have apolicy that states you must pull over if signaled by law enforcement, if so you should. Of course it also helps to maintain a good working relationship with the cops so don't just go bitch atthem and get them pissed.

Bottom line, look at risk vs gain. Is it worth risking everything you own, your spouse owns, your department owns, and anything else you want to add to the list to drive with your lights and siren on and have some idiot pull out in front of you to staff the second out squad if there is not a true emergency? Look at case law all the way to the US Supreme Court, you will loose your tail!

Also on the EVOC curiculim for the State of Ohio, yes it does now indicate you stop for each lane of traffic you cross. If you have to cross 5 lanes (2 each dirrection and a left turn lane) you shoudl stop (or at least be slow enough to make the stop if needed) for all 5 lanes of traffic. If you fail to do this, and have recieved the new EVOC training guess what you just did? Opened yourself up to a law suit due to breach of a known standard.

Just watch yourselves out there. I by no means mean to hack anyone off, just provide some information for one to consider before getting pissed at the cop who may have done you a favor.

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