Running makes you look unprofessional and make's it appear as if you don't know what you're doing. Remember, it's not our emergency, it's theirs. We are simply there to mitigate it.
Derek, I wasn't here, obviously. :-)
That's a difficult question to answer, since I have a collection of helmets.
Yea who cares about the people who pay my salary and I'm sworn to protect. : /
Getting the job done quickly isn't my definition of "unprofessional" either. So far Philly, Indy and DC firemen have responded saying that they do it. That's a lot of unprofessional firemen that it apparently works for.
Thanks for dismissing what I wrote as just me being 'the devil's advocate' and just arguing whatever point is being made. Clearly, in disagreeing with you only your point of view is valid and all others (or just mine) are arguing for arguments sake or simply to be the devil's advocate. Nice to see you've become adept at keeping your mind closed.
YOUR thought is that running is wrong, for any reason, and I can respect that. But as I stated in my earlier reply, don't get all preachy, which is exactly what you have done (wrapped up, of course, in your warm, royal purple robes of self-righteousness and condescension.)
Once again, if you don't, won't and will never run on the fireground, fine. But putting people down because they disagree, both with running as well as with you only shows your narrow-mindedness and immaturity.
I have a passing familiarity with the TOS of this site but if I've missed the part that says I have to agree with Moose, or that I should run my opinions by him before I post, please copy and paste that part of the TOS.
Twenty-three years in busy engine and ladder companies as a fireman, lieutenant, and captain in one of the busiest fire departments in the country. But what do I know.
Jack, you misread my intentions. Im not insulting you at all, I read a lot of stuff on here and you are always making arguments against whatever the topic is in a lot of them, just making an observation. For you to answer that the way you did, seams to say something about your maturity level as well. Im not preaching anything, but hey, if you say I am I guess I just have to obey the master.
Sometimes I wonder if its worth posting your ideas on here, at risk of being torn apart by all the self proclaimed wonders of the fire service. Its funny how when you respond to more calls than others your head gets bigger and the ego often times clouds the mind and makes everyone forget we are a brotherhood. If I thought negatively about you or your post I would have told you what bothered me. Maybe you need to take your own advice Jack??
If you would like to continue this like adults hit me up on my page and I will exchange my phone number with you and we can talk real time. But I refuse to have ideas and insults stuffed down my throat by someone who needs to practice what he preaches. I was not insulting you, so dont tell me I am immature and "Self Righteous" simply because I have been taught to be safe and now as captain choose to pass it on to others. I believe in safety, if you do not, fine, thats the way you roll in the big time so I will no longer choose to offer my opinions here, being as they "offend" some and "Insult" others, even though thats not my intentions.
If there is any TOS that needs to be posted, its the one that says you are not allowed to offer your opinions to those of this site who think they are better than others Jack. So sorry to have done that...
To others, my opinion still stands, I do not see the gain from running, especially when you should be sizing up the situation every chance you get, how can you when you are running?
Please, stay safe.
You too Jack.
Capcityff, is that true? Do you guys realy need to race to a fire to claim it or dont you guys cover certain districts? I understand that other companies are responding as well, but we should be working as a team right? Doesnt the IC issue orders to each unit and each unit has a job to do or do you guys still work the way they used to when it was insurance based and you only responded to those who contracted with you? (and that is a true question and not an insult so PLEASE do not take it the wrong way!! LOL) Thanks.
You know a lot and I respect you for it. But running is realy not an issue that should bear more weight if you are more experienced than others. Running is simply a safety issue that we all feel differently about, but thats what makes the world interesting, we are all allowed to have different opinions.
Are you a captain now WestPhilly? Are you thinking about a chiefs position in the future? Just curious, nothing about this topic.
You're still wrong, based on this comment of yours:
"...your just the devils advocate and love to argue whatever point is being made"
No Moose, I express my opinion, not just to argue or to be the devil's advocate. Your statement was dismissive, offensive and amazingly arrogant.
"...you are always making arguments against whatever the topic is in a lot of them..." If I'm making "...arguments against whatever the topic is..." is it really that difficult for you to understand that I'm expressing MY opinion. Funny that you can go on and on about your opinions (carefully tailored to agree with the majority, no doubt) and see anyone who disagrees with you as arguing for argument sake or being a devil's advocate.
"But I refuse to have ideas and insults stuffed down my throat by someone who needs to practice what he preaches. I was not insulting you, so dont tell me I am immature and "Self Righteous"... Uh...yes you were insulting. Go back and read my first comment and your response to it. Get off you high horse Moose, you over react every time someone disagrees with you, like now. I shoved nothing down your throat, and as for insulting you, I simply called it like I saw it.
"Sometimes I wonder if its worth posting your ideas on here, at risk of being torn apart by all the self proclaimed wonders of the fire service." Persecution complex much?
"I believe in safety, if you do not, fine..." See what I mean, your left handed phrases, like you believe in safety, but if I don't it's fine by you. So how did you get to the conclusion that I don't believe in safety? Because I do think that there are times it's okay to run on the fireground? You basically said I don't believe in safety, based on a comment I made about a specific issue; hormone rage?
Basically Moose, get over yourself. You're all teary eyed about people "picking on you" because you think your opinions offend some and insult others. I don't believe that's the case; at least as far as your opinions about an issue, but dismissing me and my opinions as just being argumentative and a devil's advocate IS insulting, you just may not be evolved enough to recognize it (and you).
To others, MY opinion still stands. I DO see gain from running, SHOULD the situation call for it. If your department lets you climb ladders and use sharp, cutty things then they should be able to trust you to use your judgment. Clearly SOME fire fighters departments don't agree. Also, if you're running, it suggests you've already made a size-up and are responding TO that size-up.
My experience tells me that running, while not without some risk, is reasonably safe. I've seen it and done it often enough that I can come to that conclusion.
Keep in mind that those who say running is bad, unsafe, or unprofessional are saying that it's ALWAYS so (except for maybe running away from a collapse). Those who are defending running are not saying the opposite - that you should never NOT run - just that it's perfectly acceptable in any number of situations.
I'm currently a captain and one of these days (even though it means no more firefighting) I hope to be a chief.
Exactly and that's what people are missing. None of us who run are telling others that they aren't real firemen or wrong because they don't. However we are being told that when it's obviously worked at A LOT of fires. Philly, DC and Indy burn every day and it's always been fine. Have I fallen before? Yes. Is it really that big of a deal? No. You get up and keep going. Problem over.