The Social Network & Community JUST for Firefighters
PASS activation.....
Before anyone gets too far into reading this, it's just a quick rant and i don't want anyone to think I have something new to share.
I'm noticing, in quite a few videos, that there are PASS alarms going off in the background. The most recent vid had the alarm going off for nearly the whole length of the clip. It disturbs me to think that people are being "trained" to ignore the alarm. In my opinion, that alarm should not be going off unless there is a mayday or firefighter down. We train that if we hear that alarm, we are to hunt it down, if it's not obvious, and find out what's going on.
To me, those that are ignoring this alarm, for any reason, are learning something bad. Just like train whistles near your home where you grew up. You just eventually didn't hear or norice the sound anymore unless it was pointed out to you. Sure, there is quite a difference here, but essentially, that's what is happening.
Why are the alarms going off and not being shut off. Did someone drop a pack and not turn it off? They should know better. How many people are hearing it and nobody bothers to shut it off?
It irritates me to no end to hear those alarms going off for no reason. If someone wants to test it, that's fine, just turn it right off again. If you don't notice your pre-warning alarm going off, then you need more experience with your pack. This goes with not knowing how to shut the alarm off. Same if you leave a pack unattended and don't shut it down. And those that walk by and do nothing, well, I don't know what to say to them. Well, I do, but I'm trying to keep this nice.
Anyway, the PASS alarm is just that, a personal alert safety system. It's not to make it feel like summer with the crickets and frogs in the background.
If you have made it this far, thanks for listening/reading. Does anyone use the pass alarms on scene for some reason I'm not familiar with? If you do, it's wrong in my opinion.
There's not much of a question here, if you feel like posting your thoughts, the table is yours..have at 'er.
thanks for your time.
KSHF
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Montpetit on
-
When we train and a PASS goes off we treat it as if it were and EMERGENCY...the old Chief used to stress that and we continue to follow the guidance...so most are very careful and mindful of the alarm.....
-
Permalink Reply by Rusty Mancini on
-
Derek, I've notice the same thing and I feel your pain brother! So many times this has happen, and folks do need to be trained to take it seriously. We treat it as Paul has mentioned.
-
Permalink Reply by lutan1 on
-
Not related to PASS alarms, but general alarms in industry- a number of years ago, we had a major fire and explosion in a gas refinery (Longford Gas Plant).
One of the key findinings in the subsequent investigations and Royal Commission was the fact that operators were routinely ignoring or resetting alarms and not investigating or confirming what they were.
This issue you raise, strikes a scary resemblance, but obviously a different type of alarm response. It has to change or it's a bit like crying wolf- a real alarm will go off and everyone will ignore or think it's just a set laying aorund...
-
Permalink Reply by Oldman on
-
In the movie Backdraft, Kirk Russell has the line; "You go, We go." I have taken that line and incorporated it in everyday activities with my guys. If one messes up, the whole crew messes up.
I have caught my people sitting around the table talking, and have gone into the bay and set the PASS off. It wasn't pretty the first time, as nobody made any movement to check on it for over 2 min. Finally one of them went out to "shut that noise off." After I finished "explaining" (foot up ass) that "noise" was one of us dying, and it is going to be their fault because they ignored it, the whole crew did push-ups.
It is truly amazing what 25 push-ups can do to motivate people to react to sound. Don't be in front of the door when the pass goes off now. There is a stampede to get out and find it.
-
Permalink Reply by John on
-
We've talked about that at my Dept. too and it drives our training personel crazy if analarm goes off an no one checks it out to make sure there is no emergency. Myself when I hear the alarm I am looking to see where it is coming from. Most of the time its a brother who has just taken his pack off and didn'tget the PASS turned off. but I am always trying to be alert, whether its training or not.
-
Permalink Reply by Josh Bertram on
-
There is a reason the PASS is so loud and irritating. It gets your attention. To train yourself to ignore it is just ignorant to say the least. This lets us know when one of our brothers or sisters is in trouble. If you hear one going off, you should try to locate it as quickly as possible. Even let the IC know that you have one going off somewhere so he can get a PAR of all personnel. It may be something as simple as a pack being laid on the ground that didn't get turned off, but should we risk losing a brother or sister to the attitude of, "Oh, it's probably just one of those over in staging. It's all good."
-
Permalink Reply by Roy Walker on
-
This is an excellent post! As a training officer I would pull my hair out over this and now it's all gone. The first versions we had were always going off and proved themselves next to useless but we improved the second time and these are much better, I find the younger guys pay more attention then some of their " more experienced " brothers, but it is a constant source of irritation to me and a constant thorn in my side.
-
Permalink Reply by Norm Tindell on
-
When someone fails to shut their PASS off upon doffing their pack, then the device activates...we (like you said) "track it down" and shut it off. We do notice them right away when we hear them. Thank goodness. Hope we never hear one inside a building!
-
-
Great idea, Oldman! May try that some time.
-
Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on
-
In my opinion it has to do with how serious they take the job. The PASS is there for our own safety. Would they let a loose connection bleed out their air? Then why would they forget to shut down their bottle? Lazy, don't take things seriously, aren't familiar enough with their pack, seldom if ever go on air.
It's just part of the costume they wear occasionally. I guess it would be like taking off the wig and big floppy shoes but then forget they still have the big, red nose on. Clowns.
-
Permalink Reply by Derek R. on
-
Wow, it's good to know I'm not alone on this.
I am fortunate enough, as well as proud to say, that I have never heard the alarm activate on a pack worn by one of our members. It's drilled into our heads, at every training that involves the use of BA's, that the alarm better not go off unless it's for a purpose. If it does, like Paul mentions, we treat it as an emergency. Then once the "emergency" is over, I like the idea of pushups for the "victim".
I've actually witnessed an alarm going off while the person had the pack on. This happened twice, not 5 minutes apart. He was just standing there drinking his water and didn't have a clue as to what was going on. TWICE !!!! And, to add, he didn't even know how to shut it off !!!
I think Jack is spot on with his comments having to do with not taking it seriousely, unfamiliar or new to the pack. If it were me, I would take away his accessability to the hot zone until he knows what the hell is going on. That's just not a safe person to be going into a hazardous environment.
Oldman, I really like the idea of setting off the alarm when everyone is busy (or not) doing whatever it is they do. If it ever happens on the fireground, you know they will hear it because they are always listening for it. And it will get checked out and not waved off as " one of those over in staging", as John mentions.
Another good point was brought up by Lutan in regard to alarms,in general, are being ignored. Just because you may not SEE the danger, doesn't mean it's not there, happening right under your feet or over your head. And that's what I was getting to in my post; that some people just excuse alarms for being "faulty"or just pay no attention to it in the first place. Could this fall into the "complacency kills" category? Or just down-right dumb? It should never become habit to reach up and shut your pass off because "oops, I didn't notice".
Anyways, guys, thanks for the comments. And like I said at the beginning, it's nice to know I'm not alone here.
And by the way, Jack. Nice clown analogy. It works. Maybe that could be an idea in itself. Whenever an alarm goes off for no reason, the wearer of the pack, or whoever (whomever) is responsible for it, should have to wear a big red nose for the next couple calls. Might not look too professional at a scene, though. Then just wear it around the station.
Take care.
© 2024 Created by Firefighter Nation WebChief.
Powered by
