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Importance of taking photos on fire scenes and dept. photographers.
There are many reasone for taking photos at fire scenes. My dad used to be a Firefighter / Fire Investigator. I used to go to calls with him and use his camera to get photos while he would help fight the fires. That is where I got my start with my knowledge in the fire service. Photos are extremely important in the fire service. They help in post incident analysis to see what went on and what could be learned from it, they help in the investigations (especially arson fires), they help to show the public some of the dangers of the job / occupation. I have been the dept. photograper for 3 years now and have had some of my photos published in the local media even. My photos have been used to review fires after they happened as well as used in the dept. local fair booth for people to see and even at the dept. open house to show what they do in this occupation. It may seem like a non-important part in most depts., but photos can help in the long run. They are also nice so your dept. can help document dept. history. The dept. has photos hanging up of some of their major calls in the years, however, they were taken by the local media and given to the dept. or the dept. had to ask for them. Photos also play a role if there is a fire scene and something goes wrong. If someone sues the dept. over the fire and the photographer was there of someone on the dept. got photos there, the photos could either help or hurt in court depending on what happened. If the property or home owner said one thing and the pictures prove different, then the photos helped big time. I fugured I would post this in case it may help someone learn from my years of experience. Below is a couple of photos that I have taken at scenes from before becomming the dept. photographer up to now.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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We have a couple "regulars" who show up to take pics of scenes and looking back, it really is nice to have some "documentation" of the job. I'm not even talking about evidence nor training, but just to be able to look back at a moment in time.
While many of the pics are from the scene and what was encountered, these guys like to go into even the more "artistic" photos like say even a hydrant bag by the charged hydrant, the pic of the nozzle on the ground, etc. Years ago we rarely had any pics documenting the history and today because of these guys, we have many pics on the walls at our Station 1 and it is always nice to look back on them. To me, I like these types of pics as opposed to those to train on or to worry about an evidence standpoint. It is easy to get focused on the job and to get lost in the present and future, you forget the past.
As for taking pics on fire scenes though, such a task should go to someone not working the fireground. There is no reason for a FF to stop to take a picture of a structure fire and then pull hose.....remember your primary job on scene is to get the damn fire out. So if looking for pics, it helps to get a few "farkles", "buffs", etc to show up and document the dept.
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Permalink Reply by Ron Briggs on
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Thank You T.O.Tyson. I am the dept. Vol. OFFICIAL Fire Photographer. It is a paid dept. though which I don't mind. I have some history with the dept. as I was on the Explorer Post that they started when I was in High School and was the first to graduate out of the program. I have known some of the members my whole life so to me it is more like family. I also look at it as I am giving back to my community by helping the members learn from each incident that I photograph to make them better FF/EMTs - FF/Medics. I have only taken photos at one MVA as I was doing a ride-along that day and it was the first call of my ride. I rode for 12hrs 15min that day and that is how it started. Next call was a vehicle fire in a structure. So that was a long ride-along. Got photos at both calls. First time going to a structure fire on a unit. I rode the ambulance that day. Always something to learn.
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That's the nice part about me being the photographer. I am only doing the photography unless asked to help on certain things like get radio batteries out of the engine for command, help get power cable for light off truck so they can do salvage or help get a spare SCBA cylinger off the engine for one of the personnel. I have a family history in the fire service so I know a lot of what goes on and what to do. I was even shown on one of our local news telecasts when I was shown with personnel by an engine at the scene of a structure fire after the fire was out waiting for the red cross to arrive. I recorded the newscast so I have a record of it. Something nice for history.
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Permalink Reply by Oldman on
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An official department photographer/videographer whose sole job function is to document official department activities, and knows what can and cannot be captured, can be a valuable asset for the department.
My problem is when you have firefighters, or medics taking pictures instead of the job they are supposed to be doing.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Harkey on
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I replied to one of your previous post on the subject. Our department does have a dedicated photographer. I would like to know if most of the departments that do have one, has a written SOP in place covering the photographers duties and what will and will not be photographed? Also if the photographs are official department photos do they become public record?
So far we really like having the photographer around and she does a great job. But what if you have one that does not know firefighting operations at all and has really bad timing? If they seem to only get the pictures that you really don't want to show to the world? Its one thing to use as training, but quite another to give a bad impression of the department. I say all of that to bring up the question of, what training do you offer to your photographer?
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Permalink Reply by 55 TRUCK on
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Ron, we have not only Todd parker from Photo-Tac. http://www.phototac.com/master.htm
But a few retired firemen who are part of our PR section. Then we have the fire investigatores. The PR and investigatores get really good photos, because they are toned out on the intial call. Photo-Tac has to listen on a scanner and depending on how far away the incident is, may not get to the scene in time to get good photos.
The photos taken by our retired firemen are placed on the Z drive of our station computers. Unfortunitly we are unable to copy them so as to place them on our own computers.
Fire photos are important for investigations,training and to tell of us of our departements and what we did. A way to show future firemen the history of our department. In many ways this is more important in the long run than the investigative or training use.
Like many depatments across the country that wage a never ending battle against fire. We have our casualties. On occasion a person or persons will come to the IFD museum at the Union Hall. They will look at pictures of scenes and events. Pointing at a fireman in a photo they will say. "That is my Dad, he was kiled." or " He was my husband." For a son or daughter who lost there father or mother when they were very young. A photo in a museum or on a station wall, means alot.
Yes Fire Photos are important.
God Bless
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Reply for Michael Harkey: I learned some of my skills from my dad while he was a firefighter / investigator as well as going to some of his schooling with him when I was younger and the rest was pretty much self taught just by taking photos. I own the photos I take per the chief since I use my own camera gear though they are given a full copy of the pics I take with authorization from me to use as they want for training or public safety training (station / booth at the fair, open house, press releases). We have no written SOP on this as the chief told me that due to my backround knowledge in it for so many years I should know what to shoot and what not to. The limitations for me are not to be in the hot zone / collapse zone and watch that I don't get in the way too much. I had a fire that I responded to last November that turned out to be suspicious and I didn't get around back to photograph due to downed power lines. The chief then asked me if I got rear photos and I said not due to the down lines. Now, if something happens like that again, I am instructed to ask command to be escorted to the back so I can get the shots safely. I treat all downed lines as they are live, so that is why I didn't go in back. I have authorization to publish my photos in trade magazines and to post online to show on fire / ems sites to show my work as long as I watch what I post (nothing that could hurt the dept like for example not full gear on fire scene). If you have a photographer that does not know firefighting, you could give that person a little training so the person can have a better understanding on it, have the person read up on the topic, orfind someone else to do the photography. The photos do not necessarily become part of public record unless it was taken by a member on the roster as part of their duty or with dept. equipment. I am not on the official roster and use my own equipment. I hope this helps clarify things for you. If you would like more information, please let me know. Thank you.
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Thank You 55 Truck for that insite as well as your posts. This is another reason why I like to take the photos. I have done 1 retirement already, however, I dread the day that one of the members makes the ultimate sacrifice. I hope not in my time but you never know. A number of years back our dept had 3 personnel made a heroic rescue saving a person just prior to flash over as the room flashed as the last firefighter was about to finish getting on the ladder to get down from the rescue. Luckily, no firefighters were hurt or killed and the people rescued from the fire survived. The 3 personnel now have the picture on a plaque hanging in the station as well as at our state fire museum. I am trying to get a plan together to get all members together to get shift photos so they can be hung in the station. I didn't get to it this year due to the dept being so busy and all the personnel changes. Hopefully next summer I can get this done.
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Permalink Reply by Mark Klaene on
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I support photos of fire scenes, MVAs and other runs BUT like everything we do, it must be done correctly . Not just taking them but what happens to them afterwards. For us, I developed a SOP that states how we handle photos of scenes that one of us takes. There are privacy issues, legal issues and even constitution issues that you want to try and address BEFORE it comes up and bites you.
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I agree to a point. That is why I only photograph accident scenes if I am doing a ride-along so they can be used only for training purposes which I have only done 1 crash so far. Otherwise I mainly do the fire scenes and the public service projects like the fair station / booth and the dept. open house or business trick & treat time when the dept gives out candy to kids and holds a costume contest. If I am at the station for the event, I download directly to the dept computer then go home and download to mine. If I am on a call on my own time not riding then I take them home and download them, then copy them to a flash drive and take them down when I have time unless asked at the scene to come directly to the station and download right away.
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Permalink Reply by Marty Hrinko on
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I also agree with you. My dad has about 35 years in the same dept. He now does not respond to calls, but will go to the scene. He is sometimes the first one there, and he will always take pictures, which always end up with the State Police Investigator. We had a house explosion that killed two people a couple years ago, my dad was the first one there with the exception of the ambulance. He managed to snap a pic from behind the structure that if you zoom in on you can see how the propane is constantly shooting from the cylinder. The house had no natural gas, and was fed by propane, state police fell in love with it, and it was the main pic for their investigation.
I have a helmet cam that is constantly rolling when im on the incident, this can not cover only my ass, but the depts. It is also helpful for the post incident critques.
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Thank you Marty Hrinko for your article on your start in fire photography. I liked reading it. Brought back memories of me helping my dad. I went to the station today to say hi to one of the shifts and the third person to say hi to me asked if I had come in today to teach. I said not yet but it is in the works for next year if all goes well. He said that's good as he would like to see me teaching fire photography. Weird thing is, the person that asked is one of the dept. fire investigators who sometimes uses my photos in his investigations. I take this as a compliment.
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