IAFF v. Vollies

As a former vollie and now a paid guy it is always something on my mind.
WHo is out there for the Vollies?

We paid folk have the IAFF and other organizations, but who do the vollies turn to? Isnt there some way they could have their own "branch" with in the IAFF. Afterall it is the International Association of Fire Fighters. Not the International association of PAYED Fire Fighters!

Any thoughts?

Where does a vollie turn?

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Permalink Reply by T.J. on March 31, 2009 at 2:05pm
I agree but we're all covered under our state fire, I know we are in Michigan.
Permalink Reply by Scott on March 31, 2009 at 2:19pm
National Volunteer Fire Counsel is one.
A lot of states have fire associations that are primarily there for the volunteers.
Some paid on call Dept's are being accepted into the IAFF as part of other locals. They can't have their own local but they can be a sub-organization under an existing local close to them. I know of 2 or 3 Paid on call Dept's that are represented by the Teamsters.

The IAFF is a labor organization, it's charter, not the title is where it talks about being for "paid" firefighters.
Permalink Reply by Jake Fireman on March 31, 2009 at 2:36pm
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ya got me Caleb!
Permalink Reply by Jake Fireman on March 31, 2009 at 3:03pm
Hey, it's good to be a stickler!
Permalink Reply by engine 15 on March 31, 2009 at 3:23pm
Ask the president of the IAFF, he will tell you like he aleady publicly proclaimed. If you cant afford full time firefighters you should not have fire protection. So I dont see any volunteers getting into the beloved IAFF.
Most states have firefighter associations, There is like said the National Volunteer Fire Counsel, Your state Reps & congressmen. In most states they are strong backers of fire & ems. Vollies and full timers. You need to research your state and get invovled how ever you can to protect what we all love and in a lot of casses reliey on.
Permalink Reply by FETC on March 31, 2009 at 3:41pm
NFPA, VIFS, State Firefighter Associations, there are plenty to be members of... But what exactly are you looking to be "protected" from?

OK, not looking to start a war over this because Jake fireman says everyone should be represented. I have in the past tried to discuss professionally the two-hatter perspective, so non-U's could be further educated. Now Jake, I would like to know if you were willing to PAY when you were a volunteer; 1% of your annual salary (thats your non-fire job's pay; and don;t say (0) or NOTHING because you do it for free) Are you willing to pay that as dues to the IAFF organization? You see that neat little sticker that some feel the need to display even though they are not members on their car is paid for by brothers who are willing to pay to be a member, be represented and reap the rewards of the organization.

BTW: Just so everyone understands... not all paid guys are IAFF either.
Permalink Reply by Scott on March 31, 2009 at 3:52pm
He said that about 1 particular place in a speach, not everywhere, everytime. It would be foolish to think every dept in the country should or needs to be full-time. Even NYC and LA still have volunteers and paid on call guys.
Why do we always need to get into a bashing match? I was a volley in the past. I never got the animosity some have for paid and vice versa. Jealousy? I just don't get it.
Some places can't afford full-time but some places are avoiding full-time because of a past concept or tradition (300 years of tradition unimpeded by progress) and not the reality. There are some areas around me that have volunteer or paid on call but they are really putting on a show. 2 guys on a truck for a working fire. Mutual aid being better staffed and being first in. Some areas are not getting the amount of volunteers they need to be safe but are hanging on to the all volunteer way because? Pride? Costs? What about safety and getting the job done.
I am not saying all volunteer Dept's are bad or understaffed but I don't know about your part of the country but with the amount of time these guys need to train and run calls they are running out of hours in the day to have a job and family as well as volunteer.
Permalink Reply by Jake Fireman on March 31, 2009 at 4:21pm
FETC

As a matter of fact YES, I would have been willing to pay that amount to be a volunteer firefighter and be represented by the IAFF. I'm not trying to start anything either...I just think that ALL firefighters deserve the same union "type" representation, training etc. In my vollie department we were "at will" employees. Our Chief could fire us at any reason for any reason, with no recourse. I understand that all paid firefighters are not IAFF members also. I just asked a question out of concern for the 70% of the fire departments that are not paid. They are brothers as well. They started what we all call our "profession". There was no anger in the issue. just curiosity.
Permalink Reply by Paul Montpetit on March 31, 2009 at 4:27pm
A Vollie turns to his partner....his Brother or Sister......in good times or in bad....and thats the way it should be....Paul..... Remember to Keep the Faith
Permalink Reply by FETC on March 31, 2009 at 4:36pm
Your perspective.... but wow I didn't realize that only vollies do this... thanks for the update Paul.

I guess roofing a fellow brothers house when they are in need of a hand, or working his actual shifts so he can have a weekly paycheck, while he or his child are being treated for terminal illness, or simply fighting the red devil together... hell I can go on and on with examples but I guess in doesn't matter because of the word PAID is attached.
Smoke EaterPermalink Reply by Smoke Eater on March 31, 2009 at 4:50pm
We have the IVFA, which stands for Indiana Volunteer Firemens' Association. Not really a union but they do have some benifits for us.
Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on March 31, 2009 at 6:37pm
The funny thing here is the amount of importance anyone puts on the IAFF. I work for two vollie/part time departments and am Full time, IAFF for a living. Just because we are Union does not mean that the IAFF has our backs. My department has 42 members at this time, they could care less about most of our issues. If it is a big issue that will make big sensational headlines, then they will be there with bells on. Unless you are a big, probably 1000 members or more department, they will not come when you call them for 99% of things you would want them to. The problem here is that the smaller departments are the ones that usually lack the resources to fight these issues and need the help the most. So, to say that all is brighter because of the IAFF, is a complete fallacy. The strength comes from the membership, no matter what type of department. There have been stories in the news in the last few months where vollie departments have walked out due to politics. The point here is that there is strength in unity. If there is an issue that needs to be fought, fight it. It makes no dfference what type of department or association/Union you are part of at all. If you stand together, you can fight together and get what you want, most of the time.

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