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First Due Officer Size-up
A photo discussion for you from First Due Questions, one of our many Fire and EMS bloggers,
You are dispatched first-in to a large, single-family home with reports of heavy fire showing from the roof. While responding you spot the heavy column of smoke. You arrive to find this. It is unknown if the home is occupied. Your closest hydrant is 300 feet away and the second-in engine and ladder are six minutes out. What are your actions as the first due officer?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by captnjak on
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Looks like a possible lightweight construction home. Lightweight wood truss roof support would be real close to collapsing entire roof onto top floor with that amount of fire. Who knows what else would go at that point? First due units should take whatever actions are needed to set up for large caliber exterior stream operation. Can they pump in line or is relay necessary? We don't know where this fire started yet either. There is burning material on ground on "B" side of home, but it also looks possible that fire is out a window on that side at basement level. Not really sure from picture. Wouldn't mind seeing front of building also. Hard to fully size up from rear. As with water supply I mentioned earlier, local knowledge of construction types would be nice too.
After knocking down attic and roof fire from exterior, search could be conducted based on assessment of structural integrity.
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Permalink Reply by Derek J Sinesi on
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First a quick walk around while a hit on roof is taking place. Not to worried about ventilation its already done. Depending on what walk around reveals if structure looks fairly safe i'm going to stop exterior attack and start search and interior attack.
Like Captnjak stated would be nice to see the front of the house and most likely is going to be light weight constructionWith hydrant only 300' away first truck in is hitting the hydrant.
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Permalink Reply by Chris Moyer on
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1st due hit the hydrant and set up for exterior ops. Along with second due and ladder. Once that is darkened down check on the structural integrity. Possibly do a search and interior fight to get the rest.
Kyle why vent its already done.
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Permalink Reply by Michael McCarthy on
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We run 5 man engines so I am going to base it on that - 1st due pick up the hydrant and establish a positive water supply - hopefully you can drop a 5 inch. Extra engine and tower ladder based on the smoke condition from a distance if one isn't already coming. 1st line off could be a deck gun if the MPO can manage it from the top mounted pump panel. Collapse looks like it already has taken place on the exposure #4 side and judging by the volume of fire looks like the middle and #2 side aren't far behind.. Officer and firefighter perform as quick as possible a search of the second floor if you think it can be done safely, if not continue with the search on the first floor. Again this is going to be a risk vs reward, but do you take a line to the second floor ? Or wait for some of the fire to be knocked down from the exterior first before proceeding ?.. That's going to be based on how much progress that master stream is making from the outside and what is the heat condition above you on the second floor. If the interior line thinks its too hot them pull it out - go to a 2-1/2 - break the second floor windows and start pouring water. Otherwise its a 1-3/4 to the second floor with the 2 firefighters and open up and start pouring water. The Officer has be in cognizant that a collapse is a real possibility so he needs to be in contact with the MPO and be aware of the fire conditions from the outside. Just my 2 cents.
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I also wondered if some portion of the roof had already collapsed. Couldn't really tell due to smoke condition.
If you believe collapse is imminent, how can you send an interior line in, regardless of heat condition? How can you send in a search team?
Are you operating master streams from exterior while line operates interior?
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Kyle, Car in the garage or not day or night should not make a decision for any of us. Maybe 85 year old grandma is in the house and everyone else is shopping.
It burns my butt when people base that there may or may not be someone in a building do to a car or truck in the driveway or not. You could go to my house and have 5 cars in the driveway and nobody will be there or no cars and 2 or 3 of us there. We owe it to the citizens we swore to protect to assume a building is occupied until we say its not occupied. When we roll up on a scene and the family says everyone is out we search anyhow. Johnny's friend could of came over or sue's boyfriend and nobody knew they were there. Just have to assume its occupied until we say it is not. Just that simple.
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Permalink Reply by Don Catenacci on
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Mater streams from the exterior hoping for a knockdown. I will say the A-B-C side roof has collapsed.
I would not do any additional venting simply because all lower level venting will do is create a flow path of fresh air feeding the high level fire.A search may be done once the main body of fire is knocked down. To me this is a building quickly on its way to collapse if the fire isn't killed quickly. I would not put crews inside before knockdown.
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Sorry for getting back late.
A lot has to do with what that officer sees and what conditions are like when he opens that first door for entry. Looks like for the most part its in the attic and roof area. Again, that's just looking from the outside so the conditions on the inside may be totally clear on the first floor and manageable on the second floor exposure 2 side. That's how it looks like now - what happens when they open the door for the flow path or what the conditions are like by the time they get the line in place may change that plan. The easy part is to just sit back and lob water from the outside and call it a day. But as was said "it was unknown if the home was occupied". so I would like to give it a shot for a search with a line backing them up. If the conditions dictate when you open the door that search would prove to be more of a recovery than rescue or putting yourself in serious danger than that's a decision that's got to be made. As far as master stream operating... I wouldn't operate them in the area that I was searching due to it adding additional compromise due to weight or moving the structure. Again just my two cents.
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Permalink Reply by Robert Erb on
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Agree with Don Catenacci
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Permalink Reply by MalteseMonster on
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First engine grabs the hydrant while additional alarms are requested for manpower. As the first officer I would conduct my size up and address the utilities, minus a occupant visable (rescue), suppression would take priority over searching. If you left this fire unchecked for 6 more minutes I doubt there would be much to search.
Big water on the big fire on the roof would probably achieve a knockdown before the second due arrives. Then a Chief would probably take command and dependng on the condition of the structure the first due officer may or may not get their helmet dirty! ;)
Around these parts a house like this would most likely be of heavy wood construction. That being said, in a known rescue situation the first crew would have enough time to conduct a rapid search but at the cost of letting the fire proceed un obstructed.
The safest thing to do is to put the fire out!
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