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Fire Departments Not Doing First Responder Runs
Our Fire Department is the only one in the county out of 9 departments and the only deprtment around our area that i no of that does not do first responder runs. We used to do them but we stopped because the EMS station grew to be a giant company. They do van, car, and ambulance transports and have a fleet of about ten ambulances(they ran out of numbers for there trucks even). So our thinking was that us doing first responders was about pointless because the EMS station alwalys has a paid crew on station. I think personally that we should do some First responder calls, like cardiac arrest and second out truck calls. But almost all of the opinions up here are the complete opposites. Some people also have stated that it is harder to get Federal and local Grants if you do not do first responder runs. So if you would i would like to know your opinion on our situation, If your department does First responders, and if it is harder to get grants without doing them.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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Dannie,
Take it down a notch. You come across on here as a volunteer and how you were addressing the first responder aspect of things. I'm betting that is why Don said what he did, in going off of how many volunteer depts do operate....such as using a brush rig etc.
The stuff you are talking about now appears to be more of a combination type of dept, if not all career. If you have a minimum staffing of 12 personnel daily out of 4 stations, yes, that does change things up a bit. I would also advocate the use of a front line engine, etc in such cases as well, because of the possibility of subsequent hits after being released from one call. Whereas, if this was a volunteer dept where you had only 12 people showing up (as you made it sound before), then there is no reason that a brush rig etc couldn't respond as Don mentions.
As for the rest of the stuff you mention on SOP/Gs, local ordinances etc, you're right we probably don't know. If you are a tax based fire dept provider, then where does funding for the EMS equipment, training, etc come from? Is this all a tax base, one fund, or do you have a seperate fire and EMS type of budget?
There are a couple of services I know of that still bill for their 1st responder services for an EMS run, despite who transported. Otherwise, have you considered sending a bill to the EMS providers for equipment your dept had to use? While this stuff basically covers the EMS aspect of disposable and durable goods, but can help offset the training needed. Quite frankly, I find it confusing that the FD would absorb all EMS related costs for providing a 1st responder service, without recouping some of those costs.
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Permalink Reply by 55 TRUCK on
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Branden.
Tell us more about your department. Number of Firefighters, apperatus, coverage area, etc.
Also does your dept. respond to car accidents, do they do extrication?
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Permalink Reply by Don Catenacci on
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Chief Dannie,
I am sitting here shaking my head at your complete lack of professionalism and class and your childish response to my post. I never called you a single name and stayed on topic. Too bad you can't say the same thing. Anger is usually the last sign of defeat in a discussion.
Just because I don't like incorrect statistics let me correct your math. 3000 runs a year averages out to just over 8 calls a day for your entire department. My career FD runs about 5400 calls a year and that averages out to over 14 calls a day. We have 3 stations and cover a city of 50K population and we add about 100K to that for employees, shoppers, and visitors.
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This thread is over 2 years old by the OP. It was resurrected for whatever reason. Just don't hold your breath for an answer to your question, 55.
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Permalink Reply by ashfire on
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My brother lives in a town where the vol fire company won't run EMS calls. I understand they have two towns just along the interstate (North and South of the town) that have rescue squads that will respond to their area. Now the area outside the town is rural mountain and farming area so you have some back roads and off road areas which require 4x4 vehicles to get to some of them.
Now there is a county fire and ems service with career personnel and a chief of sorts that could rule over what the vol depts want to do and change the way they operate.
I guess at anytime the fire company may have to start running ems calls or place a ambulance or ems response vehicle in their station.
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Permalink Reply by Russ on
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The majority of departments in my county used to first respond to all incidents until costs became an issue. They went to a protocol that they only go to cardiacs, respirtorys, unconsciousnes and when EMS has an extended response time in addition to MVA's and other FD type calls
this occured after a department got dispatched to a "foot pain" at 4am
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I will say this again...dispatch can only tell you what they are told and sometimes, too often to ignore, that info is wrong. That foot pain call could have been from a fall where the person hit there head, or they passed out and fell, or they had a stroke or TIA. If you are the closest EMS trained agency you should be responding. To me it is that simple.
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Permalink Reply by Ethan Foster on
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Wow! That's all I can say to "Chief" Dannie Whitehouse's last post. That was horribly unprofessional and absolutely unnecessary for a Chief of all people to act like that. I'd certainly like to see a City Council/Director (or whatever you operate under) meeting where you don't get something you want :) People are here offering suggestions and ideas to others problems. If you don't like the ideas, leave them alone. Or have a professional discussion about pro's vs. con's. No need to get into name calling, etc.
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Permalink Reply by Marc Hansen on
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just to put a different take on this:
>the three private ambulance companies i have worked for thru the years have all replaced what ever equipment the FD has used on medical calls from the truck on scene. If due to patient condition that was impossible the FD was welcome to come shopping at our station or to call and give a list and we would get the supplies to them.
>for the FD's that do run Quick Response Service (QRS) we are always grateful for the help provided and tailor our response to their policy. If they will ride in with us, a second unit may not get sent "hot" to the scene but is sent in the event the FD is unavailable. If they dont ride in then at a minimum we send a supervisor for assistance. Bottom line talk between agencies is always a good thing
> work with your dispatch system to ensure that your FD is only dispatched for calls screened to be immediate life threats (alpha, bravo, E1, E2 whatever your area uses), if your area doesnt use some type of screening program to make sure the best resources are dispatched for a medical call then that is an entirely different fight.
For paid departments running QRS is another tool for justifying manpower, station locations...etc. For volunteer departments you may get a few more donations each year and possibly a member or two because you never know who your actions will influence.
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