Desensitized To PASS Alarms

Good morning, I guess I'm the new kid on the block. I was hoping to get some feed back regarding PASS alarms. In particular what seems to be an increasing safety concern on the fireground. How do you guys deal with the PASS during practice scenarios - most departments we've visited end up yelling "wiggle" each time a PASS goes off. The unfortunate thing about that is that the Alarm does not grab our attention the way it should in a real fire situation.

Could it be that we have become desensitized to the PASS alarm? If so how do we correct that?

I would appreciate your input. If you listen to the Charleston Sofa Factory fire audio tapes there are at least 52 times you hear a PASS in full alarm mode in the background of the transmission. Yet there is no indication of concern.... that in its self is a major concern.

Thanks in advance for your help with this.

Views: 363

▶ Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 12, 2009 at 5:01pm
I agree with you. I wasn't sure what to expect as far as responses... this has been great. I'm sure we are all on the same page when it comes to wanting to reduce LODDs. Thanks guys
Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 12, 2009 at 5:25pm
No question at all! Brian I wish every Chief would react in the same manner as yours, but it is just not so. I remember 9-11 - watching the news - overwhelmed with what was happening.... but there was a little clip of a doctor running - looking back over his shoulder - then diving for cover behind a vehicle... seconds later the dust starts to lift and he gets up saying, "I'm going to see what is going on"....
I kind of half heard and saw that - but then not one but dozens of PASS alarms started sounding their high pitched cries - I'm not ashamed to tell you I broke into tears..... I knew all to well what that sound represented. But Brian that was a long time ago for some and they forget. If our officers don't take it serious - how can we expect the firefighters to?

Give your Chief a pat on the back... you are one of the lucky ones.
Stay safe - Ed
Permalink Reply by Tony P on February 12, 2009 at 6:03pm
We train to always respond to a DSU (Distress Signalling Unit, what you call a 'PASS') alarm going off, most training is without BA, so when we do wear it an alrm going off really smacks everyone in the face! I've never knwn the things to be ignored.

Something occured to me when reading this thread. A major difference in my Service is that we don't carry radios. Could it be that you pay so much attention to utilising a radio to signal a 'Mayday' that the 'old fashioned' warning device is relegated to the back seat? That it isn't seen as a primary device any more? Just a thought.

Ed, you also brought up air monitoring, and people relying on their low-air whistle to tell them when to start moving out. We train to always watch our remaining air. Our training says that the whistle shouldn't go off until we're outside the building. Many of our instructors will come up to you and cover your air guage then ask you how much you have left. You answer should be close to the actual pressure remaining! A wild guess will show that you haven't been monitoring.
Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 12, 2009 at 7:11pm
Interesting! So Tony, if I understand you right do your firefighters enter a burning structure without the ability to communicate to the outside? If so how would you ask for help, or additional equipment? How would you communicate to the IC that you've found the fire or a fire victim? We will not allow our guys into a burning structure without a radio (thats the life line) .

Relying only on a PASS alarm is down right scarey! At your next practice place a PASS alarm in a FF glove and hide it in a large room Activate the alarm and send a RIT in to locate the alarm be sure their face pieces are obstructed - to mix it up have a smoke detector going off at the same time.... honestly I would not place much of a bet on the RIT finding the alarm too quickly. How do you call a Mayday without a radio? Well Tony, now I've got more to ponder on. Thanks for your reply - I'd love to hear more from you regarding your fire service. I'm up in British Columbia, Canada. Where are you from?

Stay safe bro - Preacher
Permalink Reply by Robert on February 12, 2009 at 7:13pm
I have seen this situation at our own dept. But the thing that seems to be true around us. Is that after someone hears it we all end up looking around to see who and if it is say a pack laying on the ground we disable the pass. And if it is on gear that is in a truck or on the rig's we disable it. But if it is not then we have a couple stop what they were doing and search it out. I have seen the tunnel vision, even found myself having it. But I also know that we recently had a older firefighter have a heart attack and was found and rescued because of his pass. That was not at my station but it was a neighboring station.
Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 12, 2009 at 7:25pm
Yes I agree. Whatever it takes to drive it home. Thanks
Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 12, 2009 at 7:28pm
Hey Robert

Thanks - it seems there may be a cure. Glad to hear "the older" firefighter was rescued. 40% of all fireground deaths are heart related - and not just involving "older" guys. We all need to work at keeping fit. Thanks
Permalink Reply by Tony P on February 12, 2009 at 11:56pm
Entering a burning structure without a radio? Yes, that's exactly how my Fire Service do things. The other structural Fire Service (an all-career service) in my State have individual radios, but not us. How do we ask for extra equipment or whatever? We leave the structure to do so. The vast majority of houses here are single storey, so it's not that much of an issue to exit for whatever reason. Most fires are kept to room of origin as well.

Now your second paragraph is a good one. RIT? What's that? I think a North America concept only. We'll have one crew enter a structure while another crew don BA and wait outside to take over - but they are always ready to go inside if a DSU goes off. We tend not to specialise here, people are all trained in all facets of the work - we don't have 'engine' and 'truck' crews for instance. We don't even have that concept in vehicles! We are more British/European in the way we operate.

But to say only having the PASS alarm is scary, is it really any different to organisations that have two methods of calling for help but totally ignore one of them? Now a 'Mayfay' call - the sound of a DSU is exactly that for us, a 'Mayday' call. All other activities stop and all attention is focussed on that DSU.

Where am I? Victoria, Australia. My Brigade is a part of the Country Fire Authority, Victoria.
Permalink Reply by Ed Brouwer on February 13, 2009 at 12:25am
Thanks for the info. Its interesting to see how others do it. Sorry to hear about the brush fires in your country. We'll keep you guys in prayer. Yes I guess what is scarey for one may not be for another.

Thanks Tony - stay safe
Permalink Reply by Dustin J. Millis on February 13, 2009 at 3:37am
I wouldnt say that my dept. has become desensitized to PASS alarms but we are certainly sensitive about the wrong things. What I mean is pretty much what has already been said except that it seems most dept's just say "wiggle" when they hear a pass going off where as my dept. officers find it neccesary to jump down the guys throat who forget to turn their pack off and then its going off in the middle of training or on the ride home from a call. Granted... maybe thats not such a bad thing, they are just trying to get guys to remember to shut them off so we dont have to listen to them. However; when a pass is going off on scene and nobody knows where its coming from. You dont hear anyone asking who is inside or if everyone is ok, instead you hear, "what mother*&^(&% left is ^&%$#@ pack on after he took it off his *&^%$# back!!!!?????" See what I mean... guys are very sensitive about the pass but for no where near the right reason
Permalink Reply by Paul Montpetit on February 17, 2009 at 7:48pm
Sounds as if some stressing what a PASS alarm is and what it is supposed to signify is in order.....Just might save someones ass.......Paul (oops, sorry Chief...did it again)
Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on August 5, 2009 at 11:52am
It also gives you the opportunity to make certain that the BA has been properly serviced and maintained.
Like Tiger, when I was chief, I was not happy to hear a PASS go off. I would hunt down the culprit and smack the PASS with enough force to get the firefighter's attention. Then, I would make sure that they understood the importance of NOT ignoring the device because to ignore the device was to ignore me.
Not good in both cases.
They have a purpose.
Art

▶ Reply to Discussion

RSS

FireRescue Magazine

Find Members Fast


Or Name, Dept, Keyword
• Invite Your Friends
• Not a Member? Join Now

© 2024   Created by Firefighter Nation WebChief.   Powered by

Badges  |  Contact Firefighter Nation  |  Terms of Service