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High rise packs.. training issue.
I would like to know how you guys/ gals have you high rise packs set up. This has become one of the topics of discussion at my dept. I would like to know if you are using 1 3/4", 2 1/2' or other, and what type of nozzle you are using fog or smooth bore. Also if you are aware of what type of standpipe pressure you are getting at some of your buildings. As you may be aware of this has been a key issue in some recent high rise fires with fatalities. Myself and some other FF are trying to facilitate a change across the entire Dept. So I just want to hear what others are doing. Thanks Med.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Bill Shea on
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The way ours is set up is 50ft of 2 1/2 with a gated wye attached to 100ft on 1 3/4 with a breakaway for nozzle so you can use fog or straight stream. The 2 1/2 can be flaked out in the stairwell and the wye allows for a second hand line to be attached by a second in company. We use a similar set up for alley lays where the engine can not get down side streets. We extend 2 1/2 hose then the gated wye and attached the 1 3/4 hose.
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Permalink Reply by AssChief7 on
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We carry 200' of 1.75" light weight hose in two 100' sections with a break away CVSSF. We also carry a pipe wrench and spanner wrench as well as either a 2.50" to 1.50" quick connect adapter or a 5' section of 3" with a gated wye. It weighs less then 150' of 1.75" hose. The officer has a pack that has an nozzel as well as another 100' of 1.75" hose.
As far as your pressure you will get out what you put in to it. But the basic was to think about it is the pressure for your pack, ours is 125psi, then add 5 psi for every floor for friction loss.
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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bump....more pertinent than word games
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Permalink Reply by Robert Hunt on
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We carry 2 sections of 75' 1 3/4" lightweight hose with a TFT 125gpm fog and a 2 1/2"-1 3/4" reducer attached to one section, this allows us to connect right into the standpipe if need be. We also carry a high rise bag that contains a 5' section of 3" to a gated wye, a 1" smooth bore nozzle, some door hangers(keep doors open), and 2 spanners.
As far as the standpipe PSI it depends on what you pump it at. Our protocols are to pump all standpipe systems at 150psi for quickwater. Then calculate your friction loss and elevations and adjust accordingly.
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Permalink Reply by Paul Hasenmeier on
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We have 50' sections of 1 3/4 and 2 1/2 folded like fdny does it. Our hose is all lightweight "highrise" hose. This gives the crew options as to how much hose to take based on fire location in relation to what the preplan is telling us for hoselays. In the highrise bag we have a 2 1/2 turndown, spanned, channel locks, smoothbore nozzle, a couple wedges and a gated wye. As far as pump pressures, we start at 150 and adjust.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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Our engines, quints, and trucks all carry the same high-rise pack. It is in two bundles, both secured by Milwaukie Straps.
The first bundle is 100 feet of 1.75 inch line and an Akron Assault break-apart nozzle. The nozzle has a combination fog tip and a 15/16 smoothbore tip. Both operate at 50 PSI nozzle pressure.
The second bundle is 100 feet of 2.5 inch line with a gated wye.
If we need more line, we can add it either from the open side of the gated wye or by breaking the nozzle apart and adding line there.
We are in the process of implementing the "Hilton Head Bag" - a custom designed bag that will carry high rise pack tools, Wedge-It door chocks, and a search/hoisting rope.
For our mid-rises with no standpipe but with exterior walkways, we just secure the gated why to a railing, lower the 2.5 inch female to the ground, and feed the 2.5 inch line with additional line from the engine.
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Permalink Reply by Cory on
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150 ft if 2 1/2 light weight hose with a smoothbore nozzle and a 1 1/8th tip
1, 2 1/2 inline gauge
An extra 2 1/2 nozzle
1, 2 1/2 double male
1, 2 1/2 double female
1, sprinkler shut off
1, light weight pipe wrench (aluminum)
Door chalks, and webbing
That is all in a bag minus the hose obviously.
We always pump our high rise's standpipes. We start at 150 and add 5 per floor. Our tallest building is 10 stories.
We will also carry extra bottles and a water can up.
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Permalink Reply by backsteprescue on
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We did alot of experimenting with different loads, trying quite a few from all over the country. We have never been a department to do something just because *insert big city FD here* (FDNY, LA, DC, Detroit, etc)
After all was said and done, we settled on the "Cleveland Load". Perfect for small hallways and stairwells. Easy to pack and pretty much kink free.
Some departments in our area are going to this for their preconnects claiming that its easier to pull. Personally, I only want to be using this for the high rise pack. It works great and by using something similar to this for a crosslay, you're just making an excuse for not training on how to pull lines.
Some fans of the Cleveland Load for preconnects claim it is so much faster and easier than the modified minuteman that has been pretty much standard for most departments in our area for years. So one day we decided to see which was really faster and did 10 time trials. Every single time the current hoseload won out over the minuteman. Maybe for a department really hurting for manpower on the first due engine this would be worth looking at, but for us, you've always got a nozzleman and layout man and our current set up was proved to be superior.
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