I HAVE A QUESTION.. IF THEY HAVE STATE OF THE ART THERMAL IMAGING ON THEIR TRUCKS WHY WAS THAT POOR WOMAN IN THE WILLINGBORO FIRE NOT FOUND IN TIME?? THEY KNEW THE 911 CALL CAME FROM INSIDE THE HOME SO THEY KNEW SHE WAS INSIDE. THE HOUSE IS NT THAT BIG ITS A ONE STORY HOME..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................
TO ALL OF FIREFIGHTER NATION. FIRST IF YOU GOING TO DO THE JOB IF ON THE FIRST CALL AN EMERGENCY GO'S OUT THE FIREMEN ON SEAN SHOULD HAVE DID A BETTER JOB ON SEARCH AND RESCUE TO HELP THAT OLD WOMEN THEY HAD TWO CREW'S WORKING ONE CREW SHOULD HAVE WORK THE FIRE AND CREW 2 SHOULD HAVE DUN A BETTER JOB ON THE SEARCH IT TOOK 30MINS TO FIND THAT LADY .THE FIRE CO. FROM ANOTHER TOWN WAS SECOND ON SCENE IT WAS PUT WORK TO OPEN THE GARAGE DOOR TO VENT THE BULK OF THE FIRE WAS DOWN THAT FIRE CO. SHOULD HAVE BET SENT IN SIDE NOT STAND OUT SIDE THE HOUSE FOR 20MINS NOT DOING A DAM FUCKING THIN, IT TOOK ANOTHER FIRE DEPT TO FIND THE LADY .. I CANT GET THAT LADY'S FACE OUT OF MY DREAMS. MY FAMILY IS WHAT KEEPS ME STRONG AND THE LOVE FOR THE FIRE DEPT. GOD BLESS THAT OLD LADY AND HER FAMILY AND THE FIREMEN THAT WORK THE SCENE .........

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I assume you mean this fire...

http://www.courierpostonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/2008033...

Pedro, I am not sure the circumstances of this fire. The reports through various sites have stated the house was engulfed in flames. (keyword engulfed) As firefighters (and I assume you are one also, although I am a little mystified at your lack of insite on the matter) when a building is engulfed with fire, a camera isn't exactly the most useful tool. The camera's can and will overheat, and the MAJOR factor would be LIFE SAFETY of the firefighters on scene. I couldn't imagine the firefighters who did make the rescue wanted to sit tight until the fire had been put in check.
As a firefighter there is no worse feeling than the utter feeling of helplessness because you know there is someone inside the burning house and you can't get to them. I also know that although unfortunate, this type of incident isn't isolated either. We protect ourselves first. Sending a team into a fully involved structure is not the way to go.
Sometimes you can do everything right and the outcome still sucks. It is part of what we do.
As Mike said, if the home was engulfed in flame....extreme consistent temps will cause the camera to "white out" --rendering it useless in a search.
When the house if engulfed like mike said the camera is worthless, and the person inside unfortunatly has probably passed on from heat and smoke. This is when you need to look at firefighter safty over a unknown recovery. You never risk a life to save a life.
Pedro, these look like valid answers to your question.

Unless you have some additional knowledge we aren't privy to?
If you stop to think, you may think to stop. Hurling yourself into a building (even if it is a tiny place) thats fully involved (which all the reports has the first units reporting) would have not only provided the homeowner as a casualty, it would have most likely led to a LODD or serious injury. The reports I continue to read say they started supression methods successfully and then aggressively led an interior attack and located the victim. (still alive) The victim was pronounced dead at the hospital, not the scene, so the firefighters did as they should have.
Rist a little to save a little, Risk alot to save alot and Risk nothing to save what is already lost.
I have to take exception to your statements.....1st...are you a firefighter...? 2nd...Were you there? The initial report was "fully engulfed" are you aware what that means...? It may sound cruel and heartless BUT if you show up on a "working structure fire" call and there are flames blowing out every window then there is nothing you can do, a rescue is not possible...there is noone left to "rescue" there is only a "recovery" and putting your men in there in that situation is DEAD wrong...one has to weigh the risk vs reward factor everytime you give the order to send people in...Don't stand there and beat your chest...it is a fact...not every fire scene is a break down the doors here I come....I understand your concerns...but you weren't wearing the Chiefs boots at this one...Stay safe Brother......Paul
Pedro, Brother... i hope you were not the one that found the woman. Are you trying to seek help with this? I ask only because I was in the same boat when I was 19...we had a ripping fire with reports of someone trapped. I was fresh out of firefighter I and ready to rock and roll so I was the first through the door to try and find him. The front half of the house was working and had flashed over, I went in through the back but it was too late.

Just like mentioned earlier by some obviously wise, experienced brothers of ours, there was nothing that could be done that wasnt already done. They did everything possible. If the small house was fully involved, no TIC, hoseline, or officer could have done anything to save this person. We win and we loose, you have to realise when we loose you need to talk it out and keep strong and ready to face the next challenge. Its how weface these challenges and overcome them together that makes us firefighters.

Stay Safe Brother...
Brian "Moose" Jones
We had a call like this about 4 weeks ago in our district. We had 4 on our engine crew. engineer, officer, 2 firefighters( Me and another guy). The fire was comming out the front window and the front door and the celing had fallen. The TIC would have whited out and been useless and in the way. We were told that the victim was in the front right bedroom. We made a rapid knock down in the frontroom and made our way to the bedroom when we got to the bedroom door it had already burned through. We found her on the floor between her bed and the window not alive. Needless to say it was tuff but what is really hard is when a neighbor came to me and asked WHAT TOOK SO LONG? (What took so long was the call to 911). We did not save her from death but we did save her from being burned.
I think you should have a CISD. It will help. After ours it was required for those directly involved. It did help. If you want you can go to my page I have the picture of that fire on my home page. If you want to leave a note that would be great. Just rember think about what went right not what did not. You can't win them all. GOOD LUCK

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