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68 foot tela squir vs 75 foot ladder
I am on a truck committee. we are tring to justify the 75 foot ladder to our board. I need ammunition on why we need the 75 foot arial vs a 68 foot telesquirt. Please give safety and useability reasons
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John Crabbe on
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Versatility.....an elevated water stream is just that....a ladder gives you height for an elevated stream as well as rescue capabilities.
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Permalink Reply by Doug on
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A 75' straight stick gives you so much more versatility over just a telesquirt. It gives you many more options for possible rescues and roof operations. I'd like to pose a question though. What is the make up of your response area(Population, types of roadways, square mileage, building types)?
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Permalink Reply by Marcus A. Oliver on
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An aerial ladder, an elevating platform and an elevating stream device shall be determined by the height of the tallest building in the ladder district used to determine the needed ladder company. One story normally equals at least 10 feet,setback in the buildings is not considered in the height determination.
An allowance is built into the ladder design for normal access. The maximum height needed for grading purposes shall be 100 feet. If you have a seven-story building, then a 75 aerial device is needed. If you
have a 15-story building then a 100-foot aerial device would give full credit since the maximum length is 100 feet. Here is an example of insufficient length of an aerial ladder or elevating platform: A district needs one ladder company by distribution because there are two three-story buildings, two five-story buildings and one 10-story building in the district. A ladder company is provided that is equipped with a 75-foot aerial ladder and a ladder pipe. The credit for the aerial and the elevating stream device (the ladder pipe) must be prorated because a 100-foot aerial ladder is needed and a 75-foot aerial ladder is provided. The credit will be 150 points (75% x 200 pts.) for the aerial ladder and 75 points (75% x 100 pts.) for the elevating stream device. Note: For full credit of an aerial ladder or elevating platform, the
equipment sheet should score out at 754 total points and a service
should score out at 334 points with no three story buildings. I took this from www.ncdoi.com
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Permalink Reply by Mike Schlags (Captain Busy) Retd on
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Hey Michael,
Looking at your departments website, I can see that you already seem to be telesquirt capital... you already have these types of apparatus, with the dual roll of being both an engine and ladder truck... You are asking for justification as to why you need a ladder truck verses another telesquirt.
I spent some time working as an engine company captain in a house that also had a truck company but still, there are folks here on the FFN that speak truck a lot better than me... with that said, here's some random thought about truck company justification based on 25 plus years as a member of my department apparatus committee... Hope this helps you come up with some ideas brother...
I would ask if you staff your telesquirts with positional assignments seen on truck companies. If you have the manpower to staff a truck company, and you have to know this before moving forward, then maybe it's worthwhile trying to justify this piece of equipment. As mentioned, you already have a couple of telesquirts that are all less than 70-feet.
- Do you have multi-story structures to justify the purchase of a truck company that includes a 75-foot ladder?
- Is 75-feet enough?
- Do you want a tillered truck company?
- Does your call load justify this type of purchase?
- Are you prepared to pay extra costs for a truck company service verses a telesquirt?
- Do you know what the different operating costs are?
- Have you developed SOG's for truck company operations yet?
- Have you defined how you will use this piece of apparatus differently than the telesquirts currently in operation?
- Do you have access to good truck company training where you live?
It would be interesting to see what kinds of calls you run, and how many are legitimate incidents. I would consider attending one of the FireStats courses to learn how to take excel data and build your justification.
I built a simple excel spread sheet that has a pie chart showing the data found on your departments online website, and attached it below. The data is old... 2002, but still it allows you to come up with some basic statistics that you can use for justifications and as a overhead graphics with your presentations. You should be able to plug in numbers and modify what I sent you... let me know if you have someone who knows how to use excel. If not, get back to me and I'll walk you through it.
What excel does for you is give you good data.
Your webpage said that your department ran a total of 2,337 alarms for emergency medical services including rescues, and 897 alarms were for fire related calls. Plug this into the excel worksheet and create a graph, you know automatically that 72% of your 2002 alarms were EMS and 28% were fire related... You can see the graphics representation on the attached excel spreadsheet.
Hope this helps give you a jump start toward making the world a safer place for firefighters!
TCSS,
CBz - Attachments:
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Note: The spreadsheet that I attached does work if you change the numbers and data on 'sheet 1'. You can go back and forth between the simple pie chart and data sheet to modify the data to meet yours or anyone else who want to use this.
CBz
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Permalink Reply by Jeff Cole on
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My company, we use a 75' rear mount, single rear axle Quint. Our second-due is an identical piece of equipment. Prior to that they used a Telesquirt boom. There is simply no comparison with an actual 'rated' aerial ladder. vs. a waterway boom with a utility ladder mounted on it. The 68' vs. 75' reach difference SHOULD speak for itself.
What is the intended use? Safety reasons are simple. The strength of the aerial vs. the capabilities of the telesquirt boom. The rated capacity flwoing with the weight limit...all the things the other's have answered with. I would bet the only selling point of the Telesquirt boom may be the cost difference?
If you intent to run this apparatus as multi-functional company (quint), which vehicle will carrythe most portable (ground ladders)? The body-style of the 75' ladder/Quint makes it conducive to carry a reasonable assortment of ground ladders. How about the rear hosebed? My apparatus carries 750' of 5" supply hose, and 800' 'deadload' of 2.5" on a "sidestacker" configuration. Add three Matydale crosslay preconnects, and two front-bumper preconnects, and there is little engine work, if any we cannot accomplish.
Compartmentation configuration allows for carrying just about evey piece of equipment a regular Truck company can carry (one exception- a 40'-50' "Bangor" ladder) plus full compliment of extrication equipment, and other specialty equipment. With all of this, the design of the apparatus allows us to keep well within the safety zone of the weight limit.
A Telesquirt is basically the addition of an elevated waterway mounted on an altered pumper chasis-frame.
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