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Why is this fire is attacked from the interior?
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Permalink Reply by Nenad on
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From these pictures is hard to see the whole situation. Photos usualy just show us the moment in 2D, we can't see what surrounds this picture.
From picture one I see a FF looking or checking at doorway. In this pose it is hard to hold the nozzle and extinguish fire.
On picture two he is standing, but I see no water stream going from his direction.
The approach to the garage is wet, so I presume that, they abandoned the attack to fire from garage and oriented to fight fire from other side of the house.
The FF on the garage approach is just standing and obviously respecting some given order.
If I wan't to be mean I can say that the FF on this photos don't know what to do, so he does nothing, but I prefer to believe that he's doing exactly what was told to do.
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Permalink Reply by Brian Mackie on
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Good job Jordan. You got my vote.. I think... but that's cuz we just don't know the whole story. When rear entry team makes entry defensive operations need to stop zactly what I have been taught. Makes sense to me! and try to push that fire back to the burnt right again... attack from the unburned side.. is that not still taught? Pretty common sense stuff in my mind, but I have been down and out for a while.. maybe things are changing..still!
Stay safe!
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Permalink Reply by Jordan Hawkins on
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Yeah Brian thats what I've been taught but I'm just 20 years old lol But I've come to find out a lot of fire ground operations are common natural sense.
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Permalink Reply by daniel windsor on
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there should not be a interior attack. exterior is the only thing you can do at the time. main support beams are failing and roof could collapse. as my fire department say's "safety first" everyone goes home to there family's.
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Permalink Reply by Spanner 122 on
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Attack from the non burned portion to the burned portion. There is no point pushing the fire back into the house. It looks like perhaps the back half of the structure is not fully involved like the front??
Not saying you're going to save anything, but it will extinguish faster and protect potential exposures.
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Permalink Reply by Leland Lavender on
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705 engine 821 on scene of single story wood frame residential with visible smoke and flame auto-venting through the front and roof of the garage attachment, 821 establishing command and will be in fast attack mode,Units on scene on tac 1 and stand by for 360, Engine-821 has established a water supply simple and sweet
We have a working fire in the garage post room contents flash (flames have engrossed the garage and has vented through the roof, the white ashes falling is from wire housing melting and charring wood shows the heat has already gone beyond 500 degrees and has caused some framework to fall from somewhere.
coming from the back and pushing the fire back into the unburned side... Why didn't I THINK about that!! I'd lose my head if it weren't strapped into my mask (sorry guys... I had to...)
No full range view im just going to use this one picture provided, Judging by where the flame is in the picture, I'm not even going to worry about saving the back wall no matter how many of my tools my friend "Borrowed" although valuable, The life and money I need to save isn't in or near the garage...
"The garage has a back access into the house..."
Still not worried about it, no one is gong to try an escape out that garage access with the fire in the way! and the property there isn't essential enough for me to focus my efforts toward until proven otherwise.
Initial tactics Just going by L.and P.(S. =Safety and safely overall) of Lips acronynm
L - Making entry into the house with and 1-1/2 or bigger (Love my 1-3/4, blower optional and would be personally selected) for a primary all clear of the structure, since it's normally just the 2 of us on a line, I'll pull ceiling(with my blower in place)and post my nozzle here to keep the fire in check while I make an all clear.
Non t.i.c.
People trying to escape from a fire are almost always in paths of egress and within 15 feet of escaping, I'll crawl if I have to make sure no one is here
Trusty t.i.c.
Scan all 6 sides of each room I'm in while I feed in some hose should my posted nozzle need some more room to advance anywhere he needs to go in order to protect life or property.
All clear? great my search/rescue team has turned into my attack/salvage team until we can knock the fire down "Efficiently".
Since the fire is being pushed inward by natural ventilation and fuel load "through the garage access" wouldn't be ideal because I'm just allowing the super heated gasses and smoke(also unburned fuel) into the near perfectly stable interior of the house. This is going to compromise my attack/salvage team and the property they trying to protect, the Life safety aspect(Remember... S. =Safety and safely overall) should at this point be taken care of.
Since all valuables and sentimental valuables are in the house hanging on the walls, inside cabinets or drawers, anywhere within the fuel loaded structure and what Hazmat tech and decided to try and make his own "Funky Flames"and caught his garage on fire.
Not through the back of the garage, I'm going to attack the base of this fire agressively and "offensively" from the outside, no more sitting back and waiting for other pictures and entrances or another engine company or truck company to show up. I've now taken care of the "I" in L.I.P.S.
ok I'm tired... input? Good, Bad, I love the constructiveness. just don't prove to me those enlargment pills are working because your a bigger .... because what I posted has upset you. I enjoyed this thread and looking foward to butting heads and learning more from everyone.
I stand by my post in the begining of this thread...
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I feel you on the personnel issue...
We run a 3 man engine company, 3 stations for a response area the size of Rhode Island, our 2nd due is from our 1st station about an hour and 15 away and only if they can get coverage of their area first. our p.o.c. list is about 4 in station 2's area. and they are hit or miss most of the time.
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Since all valuables and sentimental valuables are in the house hanging on the walls, inside cabinets or drawers, anywhere within the fuel loaded structure and what not, my neighbor has become an Internet Hazmat tech and decided to try and make his own "Funky Flames"and caught his garage on fire.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Paschal on
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Interior crews should not open the door into the garage from the house, when they do they will be meet with heavy fire coming through a small door way and wont have much room to work the large garage from. The roof does look weak, however due to compartmentalization I don't believe the crew inside is in excessive danger from collapse some of the celing joist are already down in the garage and the roof is burning off not burning down. Interior crews only take positions to protect egress for search and prevent fire from entering the living area. One does not have to be in front of a fire to cut it off.I also like the replys about the fact that we only see a small part of a large picture that is a working structure fire. Oh by the way, if we are "pushing" fire and not putting it out, where are we gonna push it to?
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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You can't be sure that the door from the garage into the house is intact from the exterior. You should get a hoseline inside the house to protect the door and the interior.
Once the line is inside, it's relatively easy to open the door to the garage and extinguish the fire.
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Permalink Reply by Norm Tindell on
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I agree also. I would not condone attacking from the exterior while someone is inside no matter what doors are closed or firewalls are in place. Too many ways to get those interior guys hurt. Jordan's assessment is the best yet.
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The rear may not be accessible for a hoseline. This looks like a SoCal house. A lot of SoCal back yards are obstructed with fences, vertical landscaping, or the edge of the canyon they hang over.
The front door gives a guaranteed straight shot for the 1st line to go straight to the key cut-off point - the door from the garage to the home's interior.
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