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Does your department allow input on the purchasing of apparatus/vehicle and if not,how come?
We are currently looking to spend $70'000 on an equipment truck.The powers that be in our department have not asked any of the members for their input in anyway shape or form."The commitee" is made up of the older guys in the dept., and they have just plowed right ahead with the project.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Deanna on
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We are all free to make comments on new equipment, but I think most of our decisions are up to our Chief, officers and board members.
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Permalink Reply by John Rulli Jr. on
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We are about the same as Deanna. Suggestions are great but someone has to say ok this is what we need and this is what we are geting
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Permalink Reply by Dustin J. Millis on
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Commitees are put in place to avoid just this sort of thing. When your dept. makes a "new truck commitee" or "purchasing" commitee, try and integrate members from different age groups, different ranks, and different opinions. I know what you are thinking... easier said then done. I couldnt agree more... my dept. faces the same general problems. When it comes time to purchase something new; a commitee is voted on whos responsibility is to then make the decisions regarding that particular matter. The problem my dept. faces most is that we vote on a commitee and everyone says "ok yeah... you guys go ahead and make the decisions." Then two weeks later, every FF on the dept. is voicing their opinion on how the decisions the commitee have made are wrong.
As you can see... your dept, where FF's aren't voicing their opinion at all; and my dept, where everyone is voicing their opinion, really cause the same problem even though they are complete oppisites.
So... how do we fix it??? Well sir, this problem runs much deeper then people voicing their opinion or not voicing their opinion. It comes down to people not wanting to give the time to their dept. that they should be giving. The same guys on my dept. who complain about the commitees making bad decisions are the same guys would never volunteer to be on a commitee or come down to the station when a little extra help is needed. You Chris, probably put in more time then required and are truly dedicated to your dept., seeing as you started this discussion. The truth is though, most of the guys that aren't allowed to voice their opinion on your dept. probably wouldnt follow through with any suggestions they made anyway. Now dont get me wrong... I'm not saying that I have your entire dept. figured out... I dont. What I am saying though is that this is a problem that I have seen every firehouse face that I have ever stepped foot in.
It all comes down to who is truly dedicated to your dept, which in todays volunteer fire service world; is not too many people. Good luck on your truck Chris and stay safe brother
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Permalink Reply by Trainer on
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If you have an idea for a truck, you need to sell it to the powers above or the members in general, play department politics. The truck we just ordered I started to do this at the time our last new truck arrived 10 years ago. For the most part members have discussed what general directions they want to go for the next 2 or 3 trucks so the bases are there, you may need to sell what brand or widget you want. 1989 was the last year our trustees handed us a set of keys for a new truck that we had no idea was coming, we got rid of them.
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Permalink Reply by Dave Curtis on
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We allow anyone to be on the committee, voluteer basis. Once the committee members are established thats it, no one else may join late. Project is lead by Chief or myself, input is welcomed, considered and implimented as long as we are sticking to the reality of the project, dont have time for dreams and if we only had $1.85 billion to spend on apparatus conversations. Committee participates in everything upto and including pre-construction conference and bid process. After the dealer/manufacturer are selected and contract is signed, committee members are updated of the minor things that change along the way. Pre-paint and final inspections are done by officers. I feel it is important to open the apparatus committee so that others can learn the process, the Cheif and I are not going to be doing this forever.
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Permalink Reply by Melissa on
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I have a guestion on this to because i was thinking about this lasst night. What if it were to be changed that every member of the fire department had in internel link on the main fire department page, and had to vote on what is going to be purchased? Mind you im just throwing things out there, but if there was some way that all members of the dept were allowed to vote on what was needed?
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Melissa it really doesn’t work, if you get over about 8 people there is just too many different ideas and nothing seems to get accomplished. Now with that said having a suggestion box or a web link where members can unanimously make suggestions or voice concerns might be a good idea. To many times people will not voice a public opinion in fear of being ridiculed or rejected even though the idea may be good.
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Permalink Reply by Fireyladd - Retired Chief Sharp on
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We just completed the actual process to purchase a new pumper tender. The order has now been placed with a projected completion date of October or November. As Chief I consulted with my Officers and Department to ultimately put all our ideas and plans together. I wouldn't think of not including my crew and Officers in this process. I understand the need to remain focused and resolute on the goal. However, it is important for all concerned to feel connected and part of the process. Sad that they arnt at least giving you an opportunity to provide input. At least appear that they want your input. Whether they use your ideas or not is entirely up to them. But providing everyone an opportunity to be part of the process is important to all concerned.
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Thanks Trainer and that is what I am hearing from a a lot of Police and Fire is that they are in fear of that or something coming back on them. So to have an voting type software added to the departments that would allow each firefighter to go in and vote or suggest, I would think would be ok.
Remember this is a new age, lol things can change (I really swore that after the election I would never use that word).lol
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Permalink Reply by T on
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Chris as you can seee by the above posts that there are reasons for having a committee for this decision process. My advice is for non-committee members to give input to the actual members. They'll have your input. Now weather they will listen to you is another thing but at least you tried.
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Permalink Reply by Keggster on
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To ask the entire dept for input is not proper especially on a truck. Most of the members will have no idea about what goes into a purchase of this type. That's not to say you don't keep the members informed. And yes, it's important to have a good cross section of members involved with process, as stated they will not be around forever. Chief should be part of committee but not all the officers. The trick is to remember what is the purpose of the truck will be (engine, tanker, ladder/tower, rescue. etc.) My dept a 3-5 person committee is selected by the Chief and President. Anyone else is welcome to be a part of the committee but only those selected have the final say. The key to all of it, is keep the members informed step by step until delivery of the truck, Then the Chief and all the officers can decide best to outfit it (hose lays, equipment placement, etc.) still keeping membership informed.
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