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Concealed Carry and fires
Maybe an odd question, but the other day I was looking at sub-compact pistols and revolvers for concealed carry (yes, I have the necessary training and permit), and the thought crossed my mind... do you think there could be potential problems with concealed carry and working a fire? In theory, your PPE should protect your firearm from thermal exposure just like it does you, but we don't live in that neat little town called Theory.
And the more I think about it, I'm thinking this question more affects the volunteers than full time FF's; a full-time knows when he's on duty, and even if he carries while off-duty, once he gets to the station (or leaves home for the station), he can remove his holster. But for a volunteer, you never know when you're going to get paged. Do you leave the gun on you, slip it out of the holster and leave in your (locked) vehicle, drop it in the station when you grab your gear....
These are the kinds of things I think about on long drives... the "what-ifs" of life.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Don Catenacci on
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Airport firefighter, ar-15 and a .45...so what branch of the military were you in? Because if you expect me to believe as a civilian firefighter you were armed like that on an airport I will call a major BULLSHIT on that nonsense.
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To me the issue is clear. Is our job to save lives and property or to be quasi-police officers? One advantage we have had for years, some places more than others, is that we are the good guys. We come to put out the fire and to save gramma's life. Not to pop a cap in some guy's ass who is acting up when we arrive. If you belive the scene is unsafe then we call the police and we stage and wait for them to clear the scene for us. Or if the disaptcher feels it is needed they will send the police and us simultaneously and we wait for them to tell us the secene is safe.
I am not opposed to gun ownership, I am gun owner myself. I am also not opposed to concealed carryand eventually I will get my permit. But I believe a little common sense is called for and leaving you gun at home or in your locked vehicle to me when responding to a fire or ems call is common sense.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
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I have had had weapons pointed at me more than twice. A firearm would not have helped me in any of those cases.
So, did you shoot someone in the cases you cited? If not, then apparently a firearm didn't help you survive.
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A firearm helps protect you from a bombing how, exactly?
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...and trying to do the cops' job in those situations takes away from our ability to do our job correctly.
The best preparation is to focus on doing one's own job, not trying to do someone else's job.
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A firefighter that shoots someone that throws a brick will likely be charged with manslaughter, at the least. It's easy to dodge a brick. Gunfire in response is an escalation of force and in most states falls outside of acceptable self-defense.
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Yep.
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Employers have absolutely no responsibility to provide lock boxes for securing personal weapons.
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How many fire and EMS LODDs occurred in the past 10 years as a result of something that would have been prevented by firefighters carrying firearms?
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...which has nothing to do with the issue at hand, unless you are advocating for armed firefighters being able to shoot decorated war vets if they pull a weapon on you in their own home.
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Blake, you brought body armor into the discussion. You said "I do have friends on the job that regualary wear a bullet proof vest when they go to medic calls."
That is indeed morphing the conversation to body armor. If not, then why did you bring it up?
Either way, body armor is passive, and it is a different discussion from armed firefighters, since body armor is not a weapon.
Body armor will not necessariy protect you. In fact, it can lead to a false sense of security. I've seen it - reponders wearing body armor entering situations due to a false belief that they were safer in the situation with body armor than being outside of the situation without the armor.
As for what a cop in Buffalo did, so what? That doesn't involve firefighters, unless the grandmother was also a firefighter. If no firefighter was involved, why do you keep bringing up non-firefighting issues in this discussion?
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Permalink Reply by Blake Mayo on
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The issue re. the buffalo police office is related, he is a first responder like us. He was put into a situation where he had no other choice but to protect himself, there were ffs on scene as well.
As far as body armor comment was concerned, it is a type of self protection and yes, you are correct that it is a passive form of protection. Yes, it can easily be compromised.
As firefighters and those that are officers we are supposed to see the larger picture to better sereve our ffs and the community at large. In our world a ff should not be thinking just inside the box. May I suggest that we look at the bigger picture, learn from others, look at history to see how we may take better care of ourselves and others. Or should we be the firefighters that will not make any changes to the service just because we have always done things a certin way
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