The Social Network & Community JUST for Firefighters
What does it mean to be a Smoke Diver?
Do you have what it takes to be a Smoke Diver? Many have tried but been denied by thier own limitations. Yep, thats right, your limitations! I know that firefighting is about team work, but here at the Mississippi Fire Academy, we teach you about yourself as well. The Goals Have Been Set, Can You Measure Up?
The man that says; "I can't" and the man that says; "Ican" are both correct, which one are you?
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Charlie on
-
I wasn't trying to "defend" your post. I got the meaning of it. I was trying to educate others that there are many different Smoke Diver programs. The content, delivery, course length and intensity varies a lot by program. MS and GA just happen to be very similiar.
As for fire departments, that's a tricky one. Atlanta and Fulton County have been undergoing a lot of issues. Just research where you want to live and look around there. Good luck.
I have not been involved with the Combat Challenge. I do a lot of departmental training, training with the Smoke Diver program and a lot of us are heading back to FDIC to teach again this year. I hope we can meet up one day. I'm sure you and your fellow instructors would be welcome. Take care.
-
Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on
-
Charlie,
The course tuition may be free, but the department or the individual must still pay for travel costs. Career departments must also backfill each firefighter's shift, and depending upon department policy, union contracts, and etc. they'll have to pay the firefighters overtime for class time outside their normal shift period.
Free really isn't as free as it may seem.
It's easy to say that you can't put a price on training that can save a life, but the reality is that every class we attend has costs, whether they're obvious in the tuition or hidden in personnel costs. That means that we do indeed put a price on skills that save lives. That's just a budget reality.
More and more fire departments are going to be forced to choose courses that teach skills that benefit a large group instead of classes that teach skills that benefit only a select few.
-
-
Charlie,
There's some new scientific evidence that cumulative job stress may be a bigger factor in firefighter cardiac events than diet and excercise.
Information released yesterday...
"A long term study of Stress in Civil Servants in the United Kingdom explains how stress at work is linked to heart disease.
This comes from a long running Whitehall study which has been following 10,306 London based civil servants since 1985 and which is led by Sir Michael Marmot, professor of epidemiology and public health at University College London U.K. The entire document on this subject is available on line: http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/printerfriendlynews.php?newsid=04641 or http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/
Of note for firefighters: "Adjusting for health behaviours did not change the association between work stress and low heart rate variablitity, suggesting a direct effect on the ANS (autonomic nervous system which regulates involuntary actions, such as actions of the heart by the vagus nerve, telling it how to work and controlling the variability of the heart rate)....and neuroendocrine functions, rather than indirect effects through health behaviours" as a quote by Dr. Tarani Chandola, a senior lecturer in UCL Deptartment of Epidermiology.
For firefighterveterans this means that even if you get "heart healthy" and are 100 percent fit...the outcome of the stress impact on your coronary arteries is going to be significant if you do not adjust for stress from the work we are doing... The effect of long term stress without lifestyle changes inclusive of not just physical health but re hab from the stress with breaks that include family and friends can affect your health outcome."
From: http://thekitchentable.firerescue1.com/
Ben
-
Permalink Reply by SmOkE DivEr on
-
This link will carry you to our website and smoke diver program!
Thank You!!!
ttp://www.mid.state.ms.us/fireacad/
-
-
try Google Mississippi Fire Academy and see what happens. It was working fine a min ago.
-
Permalink Reply by Andy Entwistle on
-
Joe,
I'm not questioning your course or your local requirements to be interior, but here's what I don't get:
You've developed a quality course, made it a requirement, and then, according to your post, only offer it once a year to only 20 people, even though a bunch of county departments mandate passing it in order to be "interior".
Maybe you have a lot more firefighters than we do, but that limited training opportunity would really limit our pool of interior firefighters. We scramble just to get enough people thorugh FFI who have passed the medical quals to wear an air pack.
How often do you graduate FF1's and how many? If more than 20 (county-wide) annually then aren't you already guaranteeing that most will spend a year or two without being "interior qualified"? How's your retention? FF1 takes a lot of nights and weekends - I would think hearing that although the state considers a graduate to be interior, the dept. doesn't for maybe another year or more - I'd think that would be discouraging, seeing guys I did FF1 with on neighboring depts being able to work inside if I couldn't. How do you handle that? I think some of our younger guys would drop away.
(Also, maybe it's just us but with our auto-mutual aid for structures, an IC would have no way of knowing which FF1's showing up have done the extra training with the SDs (unless you have issued them interior tags, but in that case, where would the IC discretion be that you spoke of - are they interior or not? Is it 'Yes' for this IC but not that one? Ouch. What if your mutual aid is from a non-SD department - do none get to go in on your scene?)
Seems to me that you'd want to offer the course more often, but I'm sure there is logic to this and I'm just not seeing it. Just curious as to how you handle these pericpheral issues.
-
Permalink Reply by Joe Stoltz on
-
I think the county’s output from FF1 is 20 to 30 graduates per year. In the past three years our department has had four take and pass the FF1 course. One of them was quite displeased when, after the instructor told him he was now certified interior, we told our member that he wasn’t – yet. We try to make our members understand fully that interior firefighting is not a game, or sport, or the ultimate adrenaline high. It is a serious, potentially deadly job that has to be done safely, properly and thoroughly every time.
I asked one of our past chiefs (30 year member) why our department mandated the county smoke diver class for interior firefighters, and he did not know. It’s been that way as long as he can remember.
From my younger days I remember the excitement of gearing up, grabbing the line and going inside to fight the good fight. I also remember back then, I had eyes only for the fire and was I quite oblivious to anything else. I could easily have been killed or seriously injured with my tunnel vision approach to interior firefighting.
I believe our department’s approach allows a member to come up to speed on the very serious business of interior firefighting on a gradual, deliberate basis. First, the member needs to become experienced in all aspects of fireground operations: water supply, pump operation, ventilation, salvage, the whole gamut. If he/she have taken FF1, or its predecessor courses, we get the member involved in live fire drills to acquire actual live fire experience.
By spending a few years on the outside looking in (so to speak) the member becomes more seasoned, i.e. less excitable when he/she arrives on scene. This is the type of person I want going inside; not a deaf, dumb and tunnel-visioned warrier focused on the “red stuff.”
Example: a couple years back a youngster from a mutual aid company got off his truck, masked up and marched into the front door. I yelled “STOP! STOP! STOP!” in vain until he disappeared through the hole I was trying to get him to NOT fall into. He wasn’t hurt, and I’ll bet he will stop next time he hears someone yelling it. And he’ll be a lot more careful in the future; but he came pretty close to learning the hard way.
Our retention is very good, by the way; we don't get people who join, take FF1 then get pissed off and leave when they find they can't be interior firefighters. I question their true motives.
As far as mutual aid is concerned, we have a cardinal rule that is (almost) never broken: we only go in with other interior members from our department; never do we buddy up with interior FFs from other departments. If a MA Chief elects to send his members in with minimal training, then so be it. We really can’t police that situation unless the member(s) are clearly probies or – occasionally – Junior firefighters.
We currently have 12 fully trained interior firefighters out of approximately 35 active firefighters. We also have 4 or 5 "on deck" waiting to take the diver class when they have met all of the requirements.
Hope this answers your questions.
-
Permalink Reply by Boomer on
-
Check out www.georgiasmokediver.com to see what it all about and the number of 700 is low we are over that in Ga. alone. My dept also puts on a class called Search and Rescue Tech that was designed by our depts Smoke Divers it includes that curriculum in the smoke diver course plus a few things they added. That teaches you just how far you can push yourself. it includes techniques for self rescue, rescue of your partner, and various air consumtion drills. After completion of class qualifications each day starts with full gear with pack PT followed by a 16 station obsticale course then 3 mile run and then training begins. The class covers such things as jumping out a window with nothing but a rope and a halligan, rapid egress down a ladder head first out the window, buddy breathing , breathing from the regulator and off the bottle . Hot bottle swaps live fire hose evolutions escaping from hostile environment live fire search operations warehouse search drills proper use of a TIC and a nut and bolt drill final test. The class teaches you alot about just how far you can go and just when you think you cant how to dig down and find it:
The SRT Creed
When they say "Whom shall I send and who will go for us?"
I will stand and say "I am here I will go."
Show me the door that will lead to my path,
And follow me as I step through it.
For mine is a path that few consider,
And a path that fewer still have the courage to take.
But after my journey I will be strong in mind and body.
For the strength of my brothers lies in me,
As my own strength lies in my brothers.
For fear is just a passing feeling ,
And that feeling alone cannot harm me.
But without sacrifice there will be no victory,
And I sacrifice because what does not kill me will make me stronger.
Strength, Endurance, and Determination
Will be the keys to my success .
For what I have is never given but it is always earned,
And listen when I stand here and shout.
I shall not surrender I shall not retreat,
I shall stand here and fight or I shall stand here and die. - Attachments:
-
-
srt.jpg, 36 KB
-
-
-
With Universal Rescue Connector technology now being standard and transfills being the fast way to give air to a downed or trapped firefghter, why teach a hot zone cylinder exchange? Just transfill the downed firefighter. If the length of the air supply is in question, leave the donor SCBA attached - the downed firefighter will get the same amount of air. Transfills are quicker, easier, and can be accomplished in partial collapses where a SCBA cylinder exchange is impossible.
I also question this...
"I shall not surrender I shall not retreat,
I shall stand here and fight or I shall stand here and die."
I thought the point was that Everybody Goes Home, not "...stand here and die."
Ben
-
-
standard or not, not everyone has this technology and furthermore you are taught all possible ways to get the job done remmeber improvise adapt and overcome? do you want someone coming to get you that knows only one way of doing things or would you ratherthey be well versed in all aspects of the rescue buisness.
oh and it simply means that no matter what you will get the job done, no quit , no matter what.
-
Permalink Reply by Tony P on
-
Personally, I'd just hope that a couple of people were coming in! As they would be, and they most likely would be members of my own Brigade, with the same training as I've had. Should I be waiting for some specially trained FF's from elsewhere to come and get me? I still think that unless this training is given to all FF's in an area, then it's elitist.
And there's a special 'creed' for people who've undertaken extra Search & Rescue training? Oh well, I have a different cultural background I suppose.
© 2024 Created by Firefighter Nation WebChief.
Powered by
