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TPP ratings for fire hoods
The TTP rating for fire hoods I assume the higher the # the better the protection?
I see the Majestic Ultra C6 has a TPP rating of 37.4
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Cody McClung on
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TPP: Thermal Protective Performance, is measured as cal/cm2
Check this NFPA article, http://www.nfpa.org/assets/files/PDF/Research/PPE_Thermal_Energy.pdf
It's 37 pages long so you may want to just search for TPP, however the information on page 21 is interesting, and the table on page 22 provides insight on the TPP rating based on the thickness in millimeters of the thermal layer. Also, based on the data NFPA provides, your assumption that a high TPP is better would be correct.
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Permalink Reply by Chris Moyer on
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Thanks Cody
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Permalink Reply by FETC on
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Not necesarily true. Higher will provide you with more protection but can your body or core temperature handle the higher protection rate. Then you need to look at the different ratings of all of our gear. Its truly a package. Hood manufacturers will say the higher the better but I say not true. First off, I find most firefighters do not know what TPP is. Obviously with the first link you do or have the research material. Many do not know about the testing, protection and what their gear is rated to. This includes Fire Chief's who buy gear and mix and match to outfit as many firefighters with a limited budget. One firefighter with good gear, or new gear can feel no heat and the guy next to him can be screaming he is burning up. Hence the NFPA requirement for a service life. Technology changes and so does the protection.
So I have to ask, what is the TPP rating for your specific turnout gear? 35 TPP is the NFPA minimum industry standard. The hood is an essential part of our personal protective ensemble, but if your hood is 50 or 60 like some carbon hoods, then are you going to feel the heat at what is probably the highest point on your body while staying low? Likely not. Especially, if you wear you helmet and hood as a combination unit as designed with your ear flaps down. Then that TPP number is even higher.
I started a thread on this site a while ago that talked about our weakest link of our PPE. Please read through the entire thread to get the entire story. I am not going to retype it. Takes too long with single finger typing... while your ears could be very protected, your face my not be.
http://my.firefighternation.com/forum/topics/thermal-insult-recogni...
Bill Greenwood
FETC Services
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Mr. Greenwood
I read that thread and it was very good. I learned alot thank you.
I'm sorry I dont know the TPP of my current gear or our new gear we just got tonite. The new gear is Quaker the other is Bristol.
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No need to appologize. My intent was to make you and others aware that higher protection factors are not always better. Yes on paper the material will take more heat, but at what cost to our core and there is a test called THL for which gauges heat loss. With too much protection we can bake like a potatoe inside our gear.
I suggest calling the manufacturer on the inner label and ask what the TPP factor is for the set you are now wearing. They will need to look up the serial # to see what materials were used for the entire ensemble. Even with the same manufacturer, gear can vary in TPP and THL with the simple change in materials, material weight and liners.
This in my opinion makes a real solid PPE class but most FF1 curriculums are based on donning, doffing and time.... and most who buy gear are sold on cost, fancy options, and fit. Very few who spend the money will ever ask about ratings and factors. They are happy with an NFPA stamp, but thats the bare minimum.
The suggested hood in the OP is a few points higher than the minimum standard and will most likely match the gear you are wearing.
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Ok you lost me
Suggested hood in the OP....?
I will have to check that out and let you know. The TPP of our new gear and the Bristol.
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Our new gear
Quaker Advance
TPP 38.6
THL 277.46
The lady I talked with @ Quaker was very nice.
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Great Chris. I am glad to hear you had a good conversation. Actually knowing about how your gear was designed and made, how it protect you and what it is rated for is very important. That along with donning and doffing makes the end user far more educated. I use all of that in my PPE classes. Now as for a hood, you can see having a 50 or 60 TPP rated hood will not match your gear's rating. Will it protect you more? Yes but I have even seen some firefighters wear (2) hoods with 70TPP combined get burned when they didn't feel the warnings before their PPE actually achieved (MHS) maximum heat saturation (that a FETC phrase) for which at this point your gear is no longer protecting you. It is actually degradating or breaking down.
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Thanks FETC
It was a fun learning experience...still not sure about the ratings but it was fun.
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OK here is the instructor in me. I will try to explain it to you in easier terms. NFPA requires that PPE manufacturers meet a minimum standard of 35TPP for the gear company to say their gear is "NFPA" approved. There are many, many flame tests. But in short the gear is blasted in a 1700F gas furnace and must withstand the heat for 17.5 seconds before the manikin sensors reveal internal gear temperatures for the user to suffer a second degree burn. Another standard that puts it into perspective is that 35TPP equates to approximately 500+/- F exposure for 5 minutes without direct flame contact.
So if you were to custom spec the best materials in the world to make your gear or buy the heaviest weight (thickness) to get a TPP of 50, then those "protection numbers or temperatures" would increase. Higher is not always better, higher temperatures place you closer to being in a flashover, or mis-matching gear (new / old, all new but with different materials or even a hood that provides 60 TPP and your gear is 38.6, your ears would be the last thing to feel the heat, and often it is higher off the floor than your shoulders or legs. By the time you feel the heat down below, you have just shortened the time before something bad happens without earlier acknowledgement (via the ears) that is what I mean about mis-matched.
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Gotcha
So the hood with a tpp of 37.4 would be a good choice to go with our gear a little lower but not higher.
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