Scene safety is always first, thats what we are all taught, that is nation wide, even WORLD WIDE People need to understand that. If the people coming to help you get injured or killed, what good are they to you? We're having problems in my state over this same type of issue
I agree, under "Life Safety" in the incident priorities. The sub points are as stated by Byron:
I do see here where there is a small problem, and that's the failure for PD and their dispatch for using the designated "scene safe" phrasing; and fire could have recognized they were clear to respond in.
If there comes a trend for us to start entering an unsecure scene. The only way I'm following suit is with carrying a firearm. I hope it never comes to that.
If it isn't safe then you don't go in.....NO DISCUSSION ON THIS....end of story. You have limited resources...and we don't need #1 Our people getting hurt or worse...#2..We don't need additional "victims".
So to be the devil's advocate Paul, why do so many on these forums think it's OK to perform searches in structures that are way past safe?
Why do we continue to put members at risk in one aspect of our trade, but on others (such as this discussion) we draw a line and say no way!?
Because we have some leaders that have grown up in the "old ways"...the attitude that the fire is in there and I have to get to it.....even if the structure is way past saving....I went to a seminar that a Captain from FDNY was giving....He showed us photos of fires and asked what we saw....well everyone was trying to show their "knowledge" and came up with all kinds of correct terminology and scenarios....He looked over us smiled and said "Yes, you are right, but I'll tell you what they have here....they have a new parking lot, they just don't realize it yet." Maybe that's why our LODD's haven't gone down in the past 20 years....
I agree we often forget to weigh the differences whether it's worth it or not. Life is always over property and unfortunately we have to weigh the life or our own. Flames are too big then there's no way I'm sending someone in to risk if there is no chance of survival. Great point.
I did hear that the department did make a change in their policy and now when the police officer calls them in, they can go in. The officer doesn't have to specifically say, "Scene safe." They may say just to come in.