Footing The Ladder, Right Way Or Wrong Way?

I have a 'continuing' discussion with a few people (all of whom have only ever worked with/on ladders since joining the department) about the right way to foot (or heel) a ladder. Granted I was "taught" the fire service way -to stand beneath the ladder holding the rails- but when I'm footing the ladder I stand facingit (and when climbing I'd prefer the footer do the same).

I've done carpentry/construction for years and have never seen anyone stand beneath a ladder. The risk of being hit by dropped tools/materials is too great. Yet the fire service still teaches this method.

In my opinion, footing the ladder while facing it allows the footer to watch the FF climbing, be aware of any hazards (including dropped tools) and, under conditions or situations where the ladder might slip, allow the footer to actually stand on the bottom rung for additional ballast.

I'm not looking for a poll as to which way you do it but rather, sound arguments for one way or the other.

0 members like this

▶ Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by WestPhilly on July 11, 2010 at 3:37pm

Ben,

A firefighter who is footing a ladder and watching for hazards at the same time is not "Distracted", he's aware. And as important as footing a ladder is, it hardly requires a great deal of concentration. As for the the Safety or Division Officer watching for impending collapses or other hazards, he is doing that along with me, not for me.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on July 11, 2010 at 5:54pm

So Ben it sounds like you favor being under the ladder with your back to the building? Sorry I have to disagree, it is safer and eiser to do it the other way. Our man from Portugal has it right.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Márcio Teixeira on July 11, 2010 at 6:10pm

Hi again..
Let´s see if i can explain how we make an learn..
for example: the ladder is in position, one FF stand in one of the sides, for example in the left side of the ladder, he doesn´t stand behind the FF that is to up or down, theFF put it aside , and puts one foot on the ladder down to lock

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Márcio Teixeira on July 11, 2010 at 6:31pm

i got a picture a gif that could explain better, its a brazilian manual, in the picture there 3 FF, because its a diferent technic, but if you look the FF, beside..and the how the foot is, and the hand...there isn´t the risk of the FF its getting down and step the other... in a regular operation just to lock the ladder, one FF it´s enought. See the page 2.. http://www.nce.ufrj.br/concursos/encerrados/cbmerj/cas/extras/009-m... Just to finish, i´m not here with the intention of teaching anyone, there are diferent ways of doing the same thing, diferent countries, rules, technicians manual..
Stay safe

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on July 11, 2010 at 7:01pm

Like I said before.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on July 11, 2010 at 7:48pm

Philly, if you're not concentrating on your body position, your grasp on the ladder, and the ladder's movement (or lack therof) then you must might be distracted.

I agree that heeling a ladder doesn't require a lot of concentration...as long as nothing goes wrong, which is most of the time.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on July 11, 2010 at 7:48pm

Does SAFETY include catching the dropped axe in your unprotected face after it rattles down the front of the ladder? I've seen it happen, more than once. I've also seen dropped tools rattle down the front of the ladder and completely miss the ladder heeler, who was behind it.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Ben Waller on July 11, 2010 at 9:30pm

Based on what? Have you personally seen someone injured one way or the other?

I've seen injuries occur heeling the ladder from the front, but not from the back.

I've seen ladders tip over sideways when heeled from the front, but not from the back.

I've seen the ladder heelman obstruct other firefighters advancing hoselines up the ladder when heeling from the front, but not the back.

Heeling the ladder from the back is listed as a validated skill in at least two widely-distributed firefighter training texts, as well as other firefighter training materials going back at least to 1975.

If you have some evidence to support your opinion, I'd be interested in seeing/hearing it.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Reg Mathis on July 11, 2010 at 9:46pm

Have to call BS on that one Henry. Otherwise we wouldn't assign probies the job of heeling in the ladder. Heeling in is their ONLY assignment!

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Gregory Borg on July 11, 2010 at 11:05pm

Just my 35 years experience. My engine does 3600 calls a year with enough fires to keep us happy. I beleive it is safer and easier. I guess, been there done that. Icy winter, rain, wind, never had a ladder skip out that was heeled from the front (w/FF facing the building), I have seen people hit with things while holding the ladder from under the ladder but never from in front of it. Like I said before, I have worked on ladder for 12 years of my career as a FF, driver and Lt. I believe from practice and experience that it is better.

▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on July 12, 2010 at 10:07am

Thanks for all the great replies, just goes to show that we can all agree to disagree.
Over roughly the last 30 years I've done a lot of ladder work in construction. I've never seen anyone hurt from falling objects and every ladder I've ever footed, had footed or observed being footed, have been so with the footer facing the ladder/building.

I have seen tools/materials dropped and -with the exception of roofing material- they've fallen pretty much straight down, when dropped from the ladder. When dropped while on the roof, objects slide and then 'launch' off the eave, in which case they would clear the under-the-ladder footer. The face-the-building footer would easily notice and be able to pivot one way or the other (while keeping a foot against the ladder).

As for a ladder pushing out, I've countless times footed a ladder (often with someone working up on it) with both feet against the ladder, the toes/pad of the foot against the ladder. Seems like it wouldn't offer much resistance but from my experience, it does. By standing on the bottom rung the person's weight is applied in a downward force (thanks to gravity) and is not going to increase the ladder's propensity to slide away from the building but (again, in my personal experience) drives the foot of the ladder down onto/into the surface. It works. The reality is if the ladder wants to immediately slide out (grade or surface, e.g. icy) when raised) no one is going to be climbing it until a method to secure it has been established. Stake(s) driven into the ground (or a halligan), tied off to the base of a large shrub (done that) or even around the center mull of a first floor window.

I can agree that there may very well be conditions/situations where being under the ladder may make more sense, but that can be a decision for the heelman to make based on conditions and needs. Like anything else there can be more than one way to perform a certain task. I think it should be less dogma and more training.