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Rule and Regulations on Drivers regarding Minimum Age to Drive
My department is again considering to drop the age to be allowed to drive apparatus. I will give oursleves a pat on the back regarding that we do have a extremely good drivers training program. I have my reservations about again dropping the age back to 18 years of age as the minimum.
A couple years ago our board of fire commissioners under the recommendation of their insurance company raised the minimum age to drive to 21 years of age. The insurance company stated they were not in favor of this under age driving and would be carefully looking at the premium if the action was not looked at and acted on internally by the district. (NO I DO NOT SEE THAT AS A THREAT FOR INCREASING PREMIUM)
I am looking for input as to what other districts are doing out there and the reasons. I am researching this on my own because I feel even though I was one of those under age drivers way back when, that younger drivers today are not the same as we were way back then and the legal happy public is looking more closer at us these days.
I am curious to see why my department is making this move again to change the age and if the insurance company is aware of this. I think certain members of the district maybe looking to this as a way to get rigs off the floor or to retain members, both of which are the wrong way to view it and more likely the right way to see ourselves into a law suit down the road for sure.
Any input I receive here and from discussion with friends around the fire services network will be taken into consideration as to my recommendation I will make to my board of commissioners. As a safety officer it is my duty to make what I feel will be a safe open minded opinion that they will seriously look at.
I anxiously await your ideas, rules, opinions and reasons behind any of them. Please don't hold back, because I am not going to say well this is why the ABC Fire Dept over in Anytown, USA does this and I think we should do that too. But again if that is keeping ABC out of court why not look at that for direction.
I hope you all get what I am looking to do here and why. Let me say in advance to you all that reply to this discussion, thanks for any and all input you give it will greatly appreciated.
A couple years ago our board of fire commissioners under the recommendation of their insurance company raised the minimum age to drive to 21 years of age. The insurance company stated they were not in favor of this under age driving and would be carefully looking at the premium if the action was not looked at and acted on internally by the district. (NO I DO NOT SEE THAT AS A THREAT FOR INCREASING PREMIUM)
I am looking for input as to what other districts are doing out there and the reasons. I am researching this on my own because I feel even though I was one of those under age drivers way back when, that younger drivers today are not the same as we were way back then and the legal happy public is looking more closer at us these days.
I am curious to see why my department is making this move again to change the age and if the insurance company is aware of this. I think certain members of the district maybe looking to this as a way to get rigs off the floor or to retain members, both of which are the wrong way to view it and more likely the right way to see ourselves into a law suit down the road for sure.
Any input I receive here and from discussion with friends around the fire services network will be taken into consideration as to my recommendation I will make to my board of commissioners. As a safety officer it is my duty to make what I feel will be a safe open minded opinion that they will seriously look at.
I anxiously await your ideas, rules, opinions and reasons behind any of them. Please don't hold back, because I am not going to say well this is why the ABC Fire Dept over in Anytown, USA does this and I think we should do that too. But again if that is keeping ABC out of court why not look at that for direction.
I hope you all get what I am looking to do here and why. Let me say in advance to you all that reply to this discussion, thanks for any and all input you give it will greatly appreciated.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Beth on
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At our station the driving age is 21. Our insurance company said that they will NOT cover any accidents by a driver that is under the age of 21. You may take and get certified in EVOC before then, but you will not be driving a rig untill your 21st birthday and you have met our dept. standards. Our dept. standards are: 21 years old, EVOC, no points on license, a minimum of 40 hours of driving with an evaluator, after the 40 hours then you ride the rig with the Deputy Chief, and then the Deputy Chief decides if you are able to drive a rig on a call or even at all. Our standards are tough, but they keep everyone safe.
Check with the insurance company before you lower the age. You need to make sure that accidents will be covered. If 18-20 year olds will not be covered, does your dept. have the money to buy a new truck, equipment, pay the medical bills, and settle any law suits for all of the people involved in a serious accident?
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Permalink Reply by Joe Stoltz on
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We used to allow firefighters under the age of 21 to drive certain apparatus; at that time we had a mini pumper and a lad of 18-19 who really knew how to operate it. He also lived across the road from the fire house so we had pretty good response times.
But about 10 years ago our insurance company "counseled" us to raise the age to 21. I don't know if there was any financial pressure, but that's where we are today.
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Permalink Reply by daniel smith on
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Although I was one of those poeple that was waiting until I was asked to a/o I still did it before 20. Patience can mean alot to command. However Insurance companies do a very good job in messing with fire department policies. I think it shoud be on a case by case basis. Also my department has a rule if you drive it you must be able to pump it! Some folks have their driver but not a/o. Most driver training is on par with the law enforcment training. People have to keep in mind the evoc is NOT meant for full size apparatus! Only one ton chassis or similar size. Believe me an engine handles way different than a mini rescue. Oregon only requires a class c licence to drive fire apparatus I wish they would at least require air brakes for it but they don't. Some states you have to have a commercial drivers licence to operate apparatus. I'm not sure if it covers all including ambulances and similar size or not.
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Oh, I agree with this completely. It has the added benefit of keeping the younger folks interested in the business.
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Permalink Reply by Mary Ellen Shea on
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The general thought process (as released by study groups on driving proficiency) is that it takes approximately five years for a driver to become "proficient". The assumption is that one will obtain their license at the age of 16, and by the time they've reached the age of 21, they have handled a variety of road conditions and are more apt to respond properly to adverse situations.
If you add in the size factor of the apparatus, I can't say that lowering the age minimum is going to reduce the risk. I realize that this doesn't apply to everyone, I know 18 year old kids who've been driving farm equipment since they were old enough to reach the pedals, and can probably outmaneuver some DOT operators I've seen, but in broad terms, my feeling is that the more time spent legally behind the wheel before operating something as large as an engine (and lets not forget about the adrenaline factor) is not a bad thing.
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Permalink Reply by Patrick Twohig on
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In our dept. we don't allow individuals to drive under the age of 21. There are a few exceptions, such as squad cars and utility vehicles. We do allow them to take EVOC course when they are under 21, they just don't drive. One of the reason, taken straight from the EVOc book,at 18 an individual usually only has a max of two years driving experience. At 21 an individual usually only has a max of three years emergency service experience. This same course goes on to talk about when people get older also, and the limitation age plays on people.
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Permalink Reply by Chaz2771 on
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We don't have an age limit. Anyone can drive during training, but to drive during a run you must be off probation and be checked off on the particular truck that you are going to drive. Probation is a year minimum and requires that you know where every tool on every truck is and that you can operate every truck by yourself proficiently to get off of probation. Then to get checked off on driving the truck you have to go for a drive with the chief and he has you run through some maneuvers with the truck, almost like taking a CDL driving test. If he likes your driving then he gives you the okay on that truck. Bottom line, you wouldn't be able to drive during a run until you are at least 19. With our department we usually have the same 2 or three guys driving anyway seeing as they live down the road from the station.
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Permalink Reply by ANDREW PARKS on
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At my station no one is allowed to drive on their own unitl they are 18 years old and that is after they go through the evoc class and drive several times with our chief engineer and then he clears it with the chiefs and asst chief so far it has worked out pretty good as far as the age limit of 21 so other stations around the area do this and do not have any trouble getting their calls answered
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Permalink Reply by Larry Gore on
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We also have a minimum age of 21 for driving and I believe it is in everybody's best interest. It is not so much the age but the level of maturity that goes with it....I remember how I drove early in life and I watch today at the number of accidents and deaths from the accidents of young drivers.....Fire apparatus is nothing to take lightly much less an average vehicle, the size, the weight, the handling, think about it, we are losing too many firefighters as it is.
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Permalink Reply by WHM61 on
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Points all well taken, I do too agree with the processing of the age thing regarding driving. If they start at 16, they maybe ready after driven for 5 years to drive a Big Fire Truck.. Some and I will agree no matter the age get behind the wheel of a fire apparatus with the lights and siren activated and "ALL THEIR COMMON SENSE AND SAFETY" go to Sh**...
Thanks for the post, I look forward to many more inputs from you and all alike.
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Permalink Reply by Jerry Mikels on
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I would stay with the 21 yeras of age to drive the rigs and a year in the fire service before thay are allowed to drive,also must have pump ops course
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