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Meth Labs
With some states making huge strides in the combating of Meth Labs, the meth cookers are moving to other states to seek refuge from the law. Meth labs are extremely easy to build, and even easier to hide. Does your department have ANY training on what to look out for, or do if you happen upon a Meth Lab? Do they understand they can potentially allow a Meth Lab operator(s) off the hook by taking the wrong steps when finding one? Does the DEA hold classes (free) in your area to show you what to look for and what to do?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Nikki on
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the other night i was up at my bf's house and we heard a boom. come running out the house and look down the street, house blew up. we talked to one of the cops that we both knew and it was a meth house that blew up. i want to find a class to take so that i can find out more about meth and their labs so i know what to look for.
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Permalink Reply by Tim on
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This is one area that I believe we do not train enough in, which doesn't make sense because we are about the crank capital of the world. In my 4 years here we have come across 7 labs. The only way we run into one is when it's on fire (which probably goes without saying). We are "trained" at the scene in how to handle them in that we just let them burn and do exposure protection. The logic here is that if we add water, this will cool the fire thus condensing the chemicals in the air basically making a toxic situation worse. Truthfully I have yet to go on scene of a meth lab that wasn't fully involved by the time we got there anyway, but I think if we ever got to one in time we would just let it go anyhow for the reasons listed above and for the simple fact that a structure that has a lab in it is a total loss even if there is no fire.
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Permalink Reply by Art "ChiefReason" Goodrich on
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Tim:
Preserving as much of the scene is hopefully the goal every time out.
It goes a long ways to resolving cause/origin, preserving evidence if it's a potential crime scene and it will certainly be a safer scene during salvage/overhaul.
I remember a few years ago a story of an arson investigator who was killed while investigating a fire. I believe a chimney fell on and killed him.
In any event, I would use caution when deciding to let something "just burn".
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Permalink Reply by Engineco913 on
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just letting it burn is not really an option. If the home burns down and all evidense is destroyed you have done bothing but aid the meth cookers by allowing them to roam free to create a newer and potentially more deadly nazi cook lab. ( you will read about the Nazi meth method in class) Preserving any and all evidence should be a primary target while ensuring your own safety.
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Permalink Reply by ILDisasterEMT on
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Here's a little bit of a side-track, but....What can we as FFs (or soon to be FFs in my case) do to help start stomping out this epidemic. The fire department shows up after a cooker blows himself and his house up and we mitigate the damage, but what active role can we play in curbing this. Other than the days of free-basing cocaine, I cant think of a more dangerous drug in every possible way than meth, so what do we do as FFs to start bringing the numbers down?
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This is a great question. What we can do as responders is keep our eyes open and to make sure if we happen upon the stuff in operation to notify the correct departments. (state police local police and the DEA) The more times we can get these Scum Bags locked up in prison, the less they have the ability to impact us down the road. Get some training, read up on it (www.dea.gov) look for the warning signs, and then do your part to report any issues.
I will say this before we get too crazy. USE CAUTION, Meth Cookers, and users are a PARANOID group of individuals. They wouldn't hesistate to set up booby traps, or to pull a gun if your at thier house, so make sure on every building call the PD gets immediate notification. You never know with todays society
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First, they need the ingredients.
Second, they need a place to cook it.
Eliminate that and it becomes a more manageable problem.
The ammonia tanks around here used to get hit on a pretty regular basis.
Better lighting, motion detectors and better education has helped a bunch.
You go to a store and you see that the ingredients for making the crap are easy to get to? Tell the clerk that better controls need to be in place. In fact, you might have to remind them of the laws. Contact local law enforcement.
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Hi xchief. Thanks for your insight. The few times we ran into a suspected lab, this is what the "higher-ups" chose to do. It could be because each time the structure was already fully involved. Knowing that the chemicals used in the making of meth are extreme accelerants, this should not come as a suprise. I agree with the logic of not wanting to condense the chemicals that have become airborne. I mean who knows what some of that stuff would do to one's gear therefore putting the firefighter at greater risk. I also, however, agree with your logic in that; 1. It is not really a good thing to "let it burn" in that it's like letting the "animal" run free which can turn around and bite you. 2. Letting the thing burn down on its own essentially renders any investigation useless.
Engineco913 left a couple of links in "my comments" section and I will be gathering info from there on how to set up training on this subject and will present it to our training officer. I want to thank you guys for your help. I have learned sooo much since I came here. It's really great to hear the opinions of career FFs all over this country. Registering for this site is one of the smartests moves I have made on the internet. You guys are great! Thanks again! Stay safe!
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The DEA rely's on tips from the businesses as well as eye witness accounts of fire ems and Police to get a bust going. When someone goes and buys 5 gallons of red iodine (1 gallon treats 10,000 head of cattle) at one shot and asks when the next stock comes in, the red warning flags should go off. Consumer education, and business owner education that is expressed through their employees should be a priority. Any chance we have to bust them before their cook hits the streets is a + for us
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DFD, congratulations you are part of a VERY SMALL minority of fire departments worldwide to have this training. Keep up the great work
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Hey Engineco913. Thank you, by the way, for the links to DEA. I will be spending the day gathering info and tools to present to our training officer. I really can't believe we don't concentrate on this issue considering where we call home. Meth is literally all around us. As I listed in my response to xchief, I can see the logic in not wanting to cool down the chemicals that are burning thus condensing the fumes and making the situation worse from a safety standpoint. I, however, also see your (and xchief's) point in wanting to preserve evidence to hang these suckers as well as saving property. Is there a national SOP on this subject? If not there should be. This is a national epidemic. Sure, it is more prevalent in some areas but meth has infiltrated EVERY community from coast to coast. There should be a national procedure. Have a good shift, you guys. Be safe!
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The DEA when they come down for the lecture will provide you with the best working knowledge of what they want you to do. We all can sit here and have varying opinions on the matter, but since they are in charge of the drug problem across America, they are the best suited to make the decisions on creating a SOP for your department. Once you folks train with DEA, you will have a much broader scope of whats at stake and be able to implement enough courses of action. By the way, you are quite welcome for all the help and insite, I thrive on being able to help my brothers and sisters globally in any means I am capable. Not bad for a small town Volly eh?
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