The Social Network & Community JUST for Firefighters
Experience Firefighter vs a book learned FF1 Firefighter
I have been a firefighter for over 18 years now and most of my training has been on the job. Now they are saying that we all need FF1 in order to get grant monies and other certifications. I have my FF1 but feel it was a waste of my time just to get this piece of paper and so do others in my department. We have been told that a rookie fresh out of FF1 class has a better chance of getting a job as a FF do to the fact that he/she has FF1.
What about all the FF's that have been around for years and have been in many many different fires and rescues? Was that just a waste of time? They have all of this on the job training and it should count for something! I feel they are better prepared for a fire and/or rescue then a rookie just out of class. Now granted, we were all rookies at once and had to start there but to say that a fresh FF1 rookie is more qualified than an vetran of many years is no good.
Well, this is just my opion. I hope to hear your opion on the subject.
What about all the FF's that have been around for years and have been in many many different fires and rescues? Was that just a waste of time? They have all of this on the job training and it should count for something! I feel they are better prepared for a fire and/or rescue then a rookie just out of class. Now granted, we were all rookies at once and had to start there but to say that a fresh FF1 rookie is more qualified than an vetran of many years is no good.
Well, this is just my opion. I hope to hear your opion on the subject.
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Dan Hoey on
-
I agree with you Edward in theory, that training should not ever end and yes learning the basics in a boot camp is good, When I went to the ROCK in NY they tried to burn us to death and then ran the pain out of us. The problem I see now is that Insurance companies are running the world now, no live burn drills for young kids in most places wearing a seat belt on my truck after I put on my gear and don a pack and its all a matter of CYA most of these classes. All new professionals see I didnt say probie slime need more hands on training I dont mean on the job I mean real training not videos and books.
My profile says remember all you new book smart firemen BOOKS BURN IN FIRES. I mean that, we need to train for safety of us not protection of the suits.
-
Permalink Reply by Nick Morgan on
-
I think both book knowlege and "hands on" training are necessary and invaluable to today's firefighters. After almost three years as a volunteer FF, then 4 years as a Structural/Aircraft and Rescue firefighter in the USAF, I was hired by the St Louis Fire Dept. in St Louis MO. Our Academy included both "book training" for FFI & II, and lot's of physical and "hands on" training time, plus a whole lot of trips up and down the burn tower. I've been on busy companies for most of my 16 years in STL, and I know that NOTHING can replace firefighting experience. However, the classroom and "book learning" that I received in the USAF and the Fire Academy have taught me about very important subjects like Fire Behavior, Building Construction, Ventilation, Water Supply and Search and Rescue. I have found these skills to be greatly enhanced by the classroom education, and I believe that the "technical knowlege" that I have gained in these disciplines have helped make me a better, smarter, and SAFER firefighter than I would have been otherwise. This background also helped me tremendously when I have been an instructor for our Fire Academy Recruit classes. It's true that we cannot learn firefighting from a book, but there are so many subjects and related disciplines that affect how we operate and perform as firefighters that to pit one against the other accomplishes nothing but empty debate. I would always tell the recruits I was training that if they couldn't explain to me why something was the right answer, approach, tactic, etc., then they really didn't understand what they were learning. With new lightweight building materials, heavy fire loads and modern combustible furnishings, hazardous materials, and the technologically advanced fire apparatus that we have today, simple OJT just will not "cut it". Plus, then throw in the EMS and Paramedic concerns, and we see that modern firefighting is much more complex than "putting the wet stuff on the red stuff". Though we must continue to do that too! We are Proffessionals whether we are "career" or "volunteer", so we have to train and educate ourselves like it. What we don't know CAN hurt us! God bless and STAY SAFE!
-
Permalink Reply by Robert Owens on
-
You gotta have both. Initial firefighter training gets you the basic skills. Once you get to your company its there job to show you when, how, and why to apply those basic skills. I imagine you could do it all OJT but I think it would take alot longer especially now a days when fires are down in numbers and they are different such as the material burning and building construction. It used to be you had all the time in the world to go in and get the fire. Now a days if the fire is 2 or 3 rooms off when you arrive youve got about 30 to 45 seconds to do something positive or you'll be calling the rehab truck and eating nabs and drinking gatorade for 3 hours sitting on a 2 1/2 outside.
-
Permalink Reply by Joe Sheldon on
-
I fully believe that both are good things. I've seen varying levels of experience and training, and it seems that maturity and common sense mean almost as much as training and experience. Without maturity and common sense, training and experience are almost worthless.
-
Permalink Reply by Engineco913 on
-
This is where I agree. With the differant material's of today, NFPA has been great with getting the IFSTA manuals updated so we all have a better handle on today. Granted when you take the class there are sections that you can take and so to speak "throw out" because they are outdated, but the core of the bookwork is right on. Without a foundation of classroom study, the OJT can be viewed through smaller eyes. (you may be trained how to do it incorrectly by someone and it could cost you your life or hurt you right into an early retirement) Sometimes its best you eat your pride and sit through it. Even though 1 small piece of paper, the knowledge is worth its weight in gold.
-
Permalink Reply by turk182 on
-
i believe that class room and otj training are important i also believe there should be more live burns for training also. in our class there were some guys that when we went to burn once they felt the heat and seen the flames the started to panic. maybe if they could get more live burn classes it would help them out more.
-
-
I agree. I think live burns need to be an integral part of training. Contrary to popular belief, it's still possible and legal. It just takes some setting up because of the EPA etc. Very few departments here in Michigan are willing to do live burns because of regulatory fears.
It's very important though that safety rules are strictly followed ANY time a live burn (or other hands-on training) is conducted.
-
Permalink Reply by Rich on
-
I dunno if your area is allowing it, but in Suffolk County, NY they did kind of a crash course FF1 and as long as you passed the final you didnt have to do the 107 hours of training. I personally believe its just another way to cover their own Butts, all cause you have a piece of paper.
© 2024 Created by Firefighter Nation WebChief.
Powered by
