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If this post is already in firefighter nation please share the title so I can take a look. I was not able to find anything while searching past forums.

This has kind of bugging me for awhile. Now I dont know if this is just a east coast thing from New Hamshire to Virginia or if it happens all over the country (never traveled much). But I drive through these downs everynow and then and all of a sudden I have a fire truck or an ambulance coming up behind me quick, lights shining but no siren. Companies coming up to intersections maybe 15 feet before them then they turn on a siren. Shouldnt it be if your lights are on and your going to a call you should have the siren going whether its 1 oclock in the afternoon or 3 in the morning. I mean because if firefighters get in an accident or someone doesnt pull over for them in the day time they complain that the person couldnt see or hear the fire truck coming. But at night what happens? These fire trucks going all out to calls late at night with just lights going through intersections and past cross streets without any sound at all.

Just want to find out what other peoples thoughts on this are.

Should we listen to towns people when they complain that our lights and sirens woke them up at 3 am and the chief decides that we cant run with our lights going or does your department just say screw it and turn it all on for your safety and everyone elses on the road?

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Permalink Reply by Davin Eshelman on April 21, 2010 at 5:47pm

Thank you for correcting me Emmet. I guess that law or S.O.G. is only in use for my dept.

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Permalink Reply by dcarr on April 21, 2010 at 9:59pm

it ct the law states if the red and whites are flashing the sirens goin. however at three am the town residents complain. its kind of a damned if you do damned if you dont. i do not believe in running stop lights or signs even with the lights and sirens going either. you should ALWAYS stop at a red light. this reduces accident rates alot. if you are stopping at a light not running the siren to keep the people who vote on your budget happy, there is really very minimal risk of an accident. apparatus drivers should just use common sense. busy intersection, lights and sirens, not so busy, maybe just lights, BUT ALWAYS CAUTION AND DUE REGAURD.

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Permalink Reply by Oldman on April 22, 2010 at 8:03am

Prosecutor: Mr. Jones, were you using your emergency lights and siren at the time of the collision?

Mr. Jones: Yes I was. The law says I must.

Prosecutor: Were you exceeding the speed limit?

Mr. Jones: Yes, again the law allows it.

Prosecutor: In fact, the drag coefficient test performed by the traffic investigator shows your speed to have been 75 mph. Is this correct?

Mr. Jones: Maybe, but you see....

Prosecutor: The posted speed limit on that road is 35 mph. Is that correct?

Mr. Jones: I think so.

This was about the way the questioning went on a case where I was called to testify as an expert witness. At the end of this trial, the operator was convicted of criminally negligent homicide, sentenced, and may no longer have any involvement in fire of ems.

Ladies and gentleman, running lights and siren is not a defense in court. If we don't drive with due regard, it makes no difference whether we are running no lights or siren, running lights only, or running everything. Lights and sirens will not prevent us from being charged with a crime, and will not prevent the civil lawsuit which is sure to come.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Meadows on April 22, 2010 at 5:39pm

True Oldman but would not running lights and siren ALONG WITH driving like we got good sense ie doing 40 in a 35 instead of 75 not be considered due regard? If someone pulls out of a blind driveway and you broadside him, and your doing doing 60 in a 55 and it's what the law would consider a code 3 response, would your butt not be more covered if you had your lights and siren on instead of just lights?

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Permalink Reply by Michael Meadows on April 23, 2010 at 7:00am

Jeff that would depend on weither your fire dept. issues lights and sirens to you or you have to buy your own, I would think. I know it's a thoretical question but I was talking about appratus not POV, since most dept's don't issue lights and sirens.

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Permalink Reply by Oldman on April 23, 2010 at 8:56am

Michael,

My point is, don't be lulled in to a false sense of security about using lights and sirens. Driving with due regard will be harder to challenge, not whether one is using lights and sirens. Sometimes, turning off all warning devices, and driving the posted speed, may be considered due regard.

A good attorney can and will twist interpretations around to fit his or her case.

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Permalink Reply by FETC on April 26, 2010 at 7:34am

Like Oldman said - due regard. Your lights and sirens mean NOTHING if you do not drive with due regard.

Blow a stop sign, traffic light, or cause an accident due to speed, your on the hook for casuing it. And that is regardless what the law says about lights"with" or "without" a siren.