Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Brian Mackie on January 11, 2010 at 12:46pm

Three person crew? hmmm well.. its something anyway. Because of the report of "not sure that everyone is out", a primary search needs to be done. However, no RIT, no Backup for 7 minutes,.. The majority of the structure looks good enough from the pic, but doing a 360 may reveal more. Gut instinct would say, go in with a par of 2 and keep in contact.. do as much of the search as safe to do, and get out. Personally, I would not be comfortable not at least trying to see if anyone is awake and able to get them out. Fire is progressing rapidly. Exposures are next. Make sure the neighbours place is not endangered. What little water is available on the rig should keep the exposure (if any) good until next due. I Can't really determine from the pic how close the exposure is, but the radiant heat would certainly be a concern, and since the water on the rig won't knock the fire down, at least save the next building..One guy on the knob, the other can do the hydrant, and of course the pump operator... how am I doing? Garage fires always require heightend awareness, (propane, gas, etc etc) 7 minutes seems like an hour when in the need for help.
I would feel bad for the three guys that can't really do a whole lot, without taking extra risks, some of which are sure to be criticized by others who were not there for doing the "wrong" or "unsafe" thing, or "against SOP/SOG's". Easy to sit here and "quarterback" it.
I guess, if the primary search can't be completed now, the hydrant is something that needs to be done.
I am curious as to how I did. What did I miss?

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Jack/dt on January 11, 2010 at 1:18pm

Hook the hydrant on the way in, let incoming know they have to secure the water supply. 360 might very well show that there is a dormered 2nd floor. Also betting that there is a bedroom over the garage. Strong thermal column but appears to be a steady wind from the delta side, that at least is good. Hard to say from this view but I'm guessing that exposures are not going to be a problem. No visible kids toys anywhere to be seen, either very neat/fussy or no young children.

Not sure what the setback is so placement is kind of tough to say, by the time the ladder gets here there's not going to be much to ladder and no place for the ladder truck so I would bring the engine up the driveway to about where the pines are on either side and lay in from there. Once the water supply is secured (and we've layed in 5" from the hydrant) we can deploy and use the deck gun if necessary from there.

With possible (likely) entrapment it's going to be a 2 man primary search, bring in a charged 2" (our attack line) through the front (alpha) door. I'm writing off the 1/3 of the structure that's on fire, lost cause there with limited water and 7 min eta for 2nd due. Search the remainder of the 1st floor fast. If there is a 2nd floor smoke may not be too bad on the 1st, visibility on the 2nd may be poor to zero. Because of the wind, vent while searching may help visibility considerably, I don't see ventilation in this situation drawing fire into the unburned side.

Not my due area but if it were I'd be fairly confident that this is lightweight construction, truss rafters minimum. The fire appears to be drawing pretty good, there's no visible smoke from anywhere else on the building, it looks to me like it's burning it's way slowly into the rest of the house.

750 gallons is not going to go far but if the primary search is negative might be able to hold the fire back until 2nd due arrives. Failing that, go defensive and deploy the stinger and deck gun and stand by until we have a water supply.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Reg Mathis on January 11, 2010 at 1:43pm

I'd have to agree with Jack on the way to get this party started. Forward lay in with the LDH. Wish I had better intel on the D side as it almost appears that this is a corner lot. It also appears that the primary entrance is at the A-D corner. Once water supply is established, our primary concern would be making sure we got an all clear on the occupants. I believe we are right on the line for going defensive, but a 360 would guide this decision. If we did go offensive, I would attempt to make entry through the entrance on the A-D corner and attempt to push the fire out the B side. If the C side is as bad as the B side, once all clear is established, I'd go defensive and get the deck gun up and hydrating as well as pulling the 2.5 to add some more water. Contact dispatch and have them ring the power company and crank up the throttle because we're gonna need a lot of water!

Next truck will need to get some water on the car involved on the B side

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Jason Brooks on January 11, 2010 at 1:58pm

A 3 man crew for first arriving is not unusual for us. Lay in from the hydrant on the way in, all hydrants are marked in the map book for spotting ahead of time. Pump operator gets things going. 1 3/4" line to the front door of the house while second man finishes getting packed up after hooking the hydrant. Let second in engine know we will be gong fast attack due to possible occupants. If we attack from inside the house we may be able to hold the fire from getting to advanced into the house until more help arrives. Due to apparent wind conditons, the smoke looks like it will be traveling away from the house. This looks like an attached garage fire. Once a good water supply is set up, the pump operator should be shagging a second line to the front door and if time permits, possibly a 2.5" line up the drive to put some water into the garage if needed later. Unless these are all vaulted ceilings, the roof will need to be opened up due to fire extension that could be entering the upper part of the house.

I think if we can control the fire, then that is the bstthng we can do to protect any potential occupants. By going into search mode right away without confirmed location of people, we are using up valuable time to try and stop the fire spread. At this time, this is a garage fire that is mostly contained in the garage. Keep it out of the house and once knocked, send a second crew to vent and search the house.

An aggressive interior attack will go a long way on a fire like this.

This is a highly unlikely fire for us, the weather is too nice.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Pat Sullivan on January 11, 2010 at 3:28pm

Initial Scene size up shows heavy fire in the attached garage portion of the home (note the garage door opening in the left side of the building). There is also a vehicle in the driveway in front of the gargage that is beginning to be involved. The vehicle in the drive adds to the concern that this may be an occupied dwelling. The fire is already vented and the prevailing winds seem to be working in our favor. Upon arrival I would strike a second alarm with request for additional water resources (tanker). Life Safety is priority one. I would make forcible entry to the front of the house with a hose team to conduct rapid primary search then commence interior attack with a 2 1/2. First arriving rescue or truck tasked to search and rescue. 2nd due engine to support fire suppression and focus on the car

• ▶ Reply

▶ Reply to Discussion