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Hose connections
After reading Arts thread here goes a fire fighting topic.
I have a question for everybody, so far all those I have asked has not given me a good answer.
Why is it in North America we use different size hose connectors for the different size hoses?
In Britain they use one size for the 11/2" and 3", why don't we. It would cut down on the number of adaptors we have to carry, and find on cold dark nights.
Is it time we as a body re-thought our standards on equipment.
Just stir things up, why not go the whole hog and use quick connect fittings, enough of the "screwing around".
Bye the bye, tradition or thats the way we have always done it are not good answers
I have a question for everybody, so far all those I have asked has not given me a good answer.
Why is it in North America we use different size hose connectors for the different size hoses?
In Britain they use one size for the 11/2" and 3", why don't we. It would cut down on the number of adaptors we have to carry, and find on cold dark nights.
Is it time we as a body re-thought our standards on equipment.
Just stir things up, why not go the whole hog and use quick connect fittings, enough of the "screwing around".
Bye the bye, tradition or thats the way we have always done it are not good answers
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Chiefy on
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Different connector sizes have been around a long time for a variety of reasons. Historically, the thread pattern was left up to the jurisdiction or municipality to decide. In Detroit, for example they have used a different thread pattern for a long, long time. it was developed years ago as a way to keep their equipment from being "borrowed" from the, then, poorer rural departments. Also Indusrial Brigades sometime use a different thread pattern so the local FD cannot barge in and try to "take over" a fire scene.
The Storz connections are wonderful and only require a 1/4 turn to connect. While it's a great idea, it is very expensive to retro-fit all the existing hydrants (about $250.00 to 400.00 each x ???). The best way is to require new construction to install hydrant with Storz connections, and slowly retro the rest as budget allows.
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Permalink Reply by Randy Macey on
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Good topic, and pretty cool answers.... Would never of thought that one would worry about some other dept. taking there equipt. Although even with 9 Stations that we deal with, there is always kidding around that we have to watch our own equipt. Almost like the days as a little kid, when your Mom had to write your name on your clothes.... At least we have gotten rid of the string that goes through the bunker gear for our mitts....
Everything is a big investment, and no one likes change.... But would be nice as we all know that feeling that when you need something and only have one of it, that your in a mad dash search for that adpt. Quick connect fittings would be nice, and some day we will see a change. Although we are a little slower in change than the U.K. is for a lot of things. Look at there hot water heaters, we still have tanks and they have tankless water heaters.... It will come!
Mace
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Permalink Reply by Joe Stoltz on
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Interesting that you mention Detroit as having a different thread. Same thing happened in Rochester, NY and I don't know if the thread is still different or not. When I was with a suburban Rochester company we carried thread adapters because once in a while we would run into a coupling or hydrant that had "Rochester thread".
And within the past year we ran across a double female coupling on one of the trucks. One of our members couldn't screw it on to the pump. We determined later that it had Rochester thread. Made sense because our department received a lot of surplus equipment from RFD when it started, although everyone had thought all of the non-standard items had been purged.
Back to the topic: If we did somehow convince everyone to switch to Storz, what sizes would we pick? For instance, do we use 2 1/2 inch or 3 inch connectors on 3 inch, and vice versa for 2 1/2? Same with 1 3/4 vs. 1 1/2 vs. 2 inch.
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Permalink Reply by Firegal77 on
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Well, I am no expert, but i would have to wonder what kind of friction loss would occur if we had all one size couplings. If you had all 1 1/2" couplings, and were using 3" line, then the water would have to go from 3" to 1 1/2" everytime it hit a coupling, and if it were reversed, and the couplings were 3" and the hose 1 1/2" then it would most likely cause the water to swirl around at each coupling and possibly cause adverse effects on the flow of water and the hose itself. Just my thoughts.... As for the different threads, I find that completely annoying... Nothing like discovering the threads are different after hoofing it to the end of 4- 100' lines... If indeed it is to dispell thievery, perhaps we could come up with something else, like painting the couplings different, or simply writing your FD name on the hose/equipment(has worked for us so far)
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Permalink Reply by Robert B Pierce on
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We had a student from Long Island running with us while he was in college. His district bordered NYC, one side of the street had NST threads and the other side had NYC thread.
I think in the old days it was to keep rural departments from hooking to the hydrants an as has already been said taking hoses and equipment. We had a small city in our County that use to run their own thread. Not sure if they still due, they are to far away from us so we never run with them.
There is alot of new construction going on in our Town and Village, we are specing Storz connections on the hydrants and standpipe connections.
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Permalink Reply by Spanner 122 on
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I'll do my best... lol
How often are we called in for mutual aid to Britain?? lol... juuussst kidding. We use 1.75 and 2.5 here, our high vol is 5, but the vollies we run with use 4. It works fine, we're up to date on what each other is using and we're able to connect with adaptors.
I see your point, and over time maybe we will be standardized, but who's going to give in and be the one to change? That can be a big undertaking. I think it has very little to do with tradition or "that's the way it's always been done", replacing hose simply so we can skip a small step can be very expensive, depending on the size of the department.
(not knocking it).
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Permalink Reply by mike on
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its sad to say but we r way behind in technolgy ,compared to over seas countrys , usa companys dont like to spend the money to retro fit equipment they rather do it the old way.
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Permalink Reply by Donnie Bathje on
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Ok time for devil's advocate here.....I love the idea of stortz type fittings on all hose. However what happens when you gt off the line and you are trying to determine the way out? So much for feeling the couplings then. Just another twist (no pun intended).
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Permalink Reply by Huw Jones on
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I swear we don't steal your stuff Randy, (Bolton and Chelt are fair game though : ) )
Little bit of history, the standardisation in Britain happened in WW2 when the Home office took over all the town. village and city fire brigades due to the bombing. (Stations were doing mutual aid up to a hundred miles away).
When they were taken over all the equipment was standardised.
The couplings were initially all adaptored, but as equipment wore out and new stuff came in the change happened.
All it needs in North America is a strong centralised body saying all new stuff must be built to these standards.
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That's a very good point... it's nice to have that knowledge in the back of your mind, incase you get turned around inside.
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Permalink Reply by Dan Hoey on
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???? Who is going to pay for the turn over?? Sorry to play this part but with the NFPA wanting everyone to go to compatible SCBA's which I understand but want to know who is going to pay for all this standardizations. I know some rural companies who can't buy gear for all the members or enough SCBA or hose and need all they can be given. Making all things standards would be great but will never happen. How long have we been asking for EMS testing standards and that simple step cant even happen.
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