Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Wade Kunstmann on February 8, 2008 at 11:46am

I spoke to several people there a couple of years ago and they did say that FF1 from the State was required, so I dropped the thought because if you get FF1 you aren't in desperate need of the building for basic training. It's awesome for continuing training, but I was looking to get the new ones in. If you can pull some strings it would do the entire department some good.

Permalink Reply by Jacob Luffman on February 8, 2008 at 12:12pm

Do we actually need to burn something up? Can we not do simulation fires at the station? No liability on the county, able to be stoped by a qualified instructor and explained what is arround the corner. When cops train they dont actually shoot people. But not meaning to be a smart ass or nothing but I know that I would enjoy played out senarios of CFV or Experiance CVFR scenarios at the station, in the parking lot. Where ever. JT

Permalink Reply by Matt on February 8, 2008 at 9:20pm

Speaking with the training officers and my assistant Cheif today they told me that it was something that had not been tried before. I am with you Wade if a FF already has FF1 it can but a little unnecessary, it was the new ones I was thinking of. Even if we can't I guess there are still some things we can do on our own in and around the station but nothing beats fighting the real thing. The Barrels are always good for hose training but I was thinking about SCBA and "feeling the heat" thermal balance, (exactly where to apply the water) but you never know what can happen.

Permalink Reply by Jacob Luffman on February 8, 2008 at 10:48pm

yea Matt I agree totaly, I want to learn on a real fire situation, but I dont want the ones like you that want to pass along training because the county and city ties their hands with political liabilities, and there for getting discouraged with all of that and then already known low turn out, and then screw the few that might want to learn. I could try to help by seting a control burn of brush I need to burn at the back of my wood shed I will be burning anyway. I have about four evergreen tree debri in a pile ( a BIG pile) that I could hold on to until we schedule something. I dont know, I would like to help if I could. It is just wood and boxes left from the move. It has a gate to be breeched. We could use my small property to do some supervised burns. I if no one else would like to learn. Maybe I will borrow a scba and use my hosepipe and do it myself. haha. I am here to help with what little I have. Just dont give up. I am all about knowing all I can before a life threatning situation comes about. I am up for it. Maybe I can build a shack out of this stuff to burn it down. just let me know. JT

Permalink Reply by Wade Kunstmann on February 9, 2008 at 3:25pm

JT, we would be doing live burns on a regular basis like we used to but the EPA will not allow the fire dept. to do a controlled burn. Anyone can call forrestry and get a burn permit, but the fire dept. can't train? That is what we are up against. We will do the best we can with what we have just like we've always done. The problem is that most people can get through the blackout training just fine, but when the heat is on and it's a matter of survival, many of them can't follow through. It's not a mark on them, it's just that most training short of the real thing just isn't enough to know for sure how they will react. Be careful and we'll see you all soon. Wade

Permalink Reply by Jacob Luffman on February 10, 2008 at 9:14pm

Well Wade, I know your are right about that. It is different when in an actual situation. I have been learning that one scene at a time. So far I was unsure how I would feel on some of the more aggresive calls (like suiside, fatality structure, heart failure, shots fired, and 46s.) grant it I have seen all of these but probubly not as bad as most. (whatever that means, adeath is a death). But, ever since I joined up I have been gearing myself for the proper way to address each of these cases over and over in my head. I dont know how it has helped but, I have done pretty well I think being a rookie. But I have delt with dangerous live high voltage, heavy press, die cutting, and anhydrous amonia corrections, all of these will take your life before you can even relize you have screwed up. But I have trained my guys that I have taught in class and on jobs that we treat every off powered and lockout tagedout situation as if they Had to do it in full operation (which is STRICTLY againsts the rules) but if the situation arrises that they forget one of these methods of powerdown, they are trained by me one way and that is treat it like its hot even if there is no posible way to be powered on. That way if you repedidly teach, and instruction on non threating situations then they know only one way to work on it and that is in the worst situation.I to this day have not had one accident on the job and have been sent as far as Michigan to instruct Bessermatic Block presses to teach LadderLogic and proper construction and troulbleshooting of this equipment that claims deaths and limb loss over the past years. I am Not an engineer by no means but instruction was beet into my head, and I have been in near misses but worked out because of non threating training. Maybe I am just too old and set to follow the younger gungho adrinilin junkies. I feel at times that I bother the crap out of some for the training, when it seems that leaning from mistakes and repremands seems to be the meathod of choice. I just dont believe that the best training is when the whole companies lives are threatened to find out whos who and how to successfully accomplish goals by trial and error. But thats just me. If I am the only one that wants this training then I do appoligize for being so moody and persistant, I will find other ways to protect and serve the ones that will count on me when the time comes, because I will be prepared when the time comes or I will not be on scene to make that fatal or injuring mistake hoping that someone else is going to be watching me to prevent this trail and error. Sorry. It just seems like some just want to hang out and shoot the shit alot when there is so much to learn, I take my job Very Serious, maybe I take it too serious. that I will think over. I wont beg nomore, I am sorry for the trouble. JT

Permalink Reply by Wade Kunstmann on February 11, 2008 at 10:32am

JT, You are not being any trouble, I just wish that there were more training opportunities available to us. I enjoy the non threatening training, but in some cases, there is nothing like the real thing. You are right, there are many who think they know it all already and others that treat the place like a social club, but those are the ones you have to think twice about before getting in too deep. If everyone had the desire to learn, more opportunities would probably result, but when training is mentioned, a lot of people find any excuse to miss. That is why we have never been able to establish a true training schedule. Many subjects and tactics require a step by step progression and when a step is missed, it has to be rehashed before moving on. In a volunteer organization, the training process is inherently slower because we don't have everyone for a specified period of time on a regular schedule. Just keep paying attention and taking every opportunity to ask questions. EOGH, Wade

Permalink Reply by Jacob Luffman on February 11, 2008 at 11:32am

I am alright Wade, I just take working for CVFR as an honor not a weight, and do the very best I can. I just want to help and not hurt people. You know. I just know once warmer wheather hits my hours get jacked up imencely. I just dont want to miss anything, is all. I hope I did not make you mad or insult you, I have just been told some stuff that pissed me off a little thats all. Butch emailed me and I am straight. See ya arround.

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