I was so very disapointed not long ago when I watched an attempt by firefighters to gain access to a attic space. It only needed 4 fireman and three attempts to get the job done. How many dept. practice ladder work? Do depts. really lack in trainning the basics,Have depts. lost themselves to trainning what is cool or the latest craze? How do your depts. teach the fundamentals?

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Unfortunately for some departments it has become the nature of the beast. Firefighting, Fire based ALS Paramedicine, Hazmat Level A Team, Weapons of Mass Destruction, Auto X, Hi/Lo/Swift Water, Ice Rescue Technical Teams... in my department we clearly don't focus on what is "cool" or the "latest craze" but try to tap on all of these technical specialities. We focus our primary training on high risk - low frequency events... but nobody has enough time for 100% coverage unless they are an old school - firefighting only fire department.

Maybe your thread should read... Have we taken on too much with too little?
Point well taken. I know the situation . SAR , Hazmat, E.M.S.Emergecy services ect ect. I should guess that trainning at least on you primary function as close to 100% would be a goal. I have caught myself in the situation of what trainning do I attend this week? How do I justify trainning on one roll I do this week and not the other? Finding a balance is diffacult to say the least and very frustrating. I was at one time (now retired) a member of a fire dept. working E.M.S. 24-48s and on emergency services which I had many rolls. I lived it and ate it to serve my community. Place trainning on top of it all and Wow. Not to mention when it was required I conduct trainning. I can only say that some trainning is better than non existant trainning or not even trying. My comments are directed at those that feel that trainning isnt needed or that it a waste of time. You are right when you sugested that perhaps I should change the thread as Ive been there a time or two! Thanks
We regularly work on the basic fundamentals. Catching hydrants/water supplies, pulling pre-connects with use of nozzles, use of ladders, SCBA's, Ventilation, ect, ect, ect. We set up our training calender to specifically meet these goals monthly.
HA who are you tryin to kid. what in the world is training to refresh on ladders and axes lol we practice ladders once a year n i wish that we had more hands on training whether it was something new to be learned or something to be refreshed. im sorry but im a hands on person and when you have monthly meetings and drills i dnt expect to be sittn in some classroom goin over papers from the past. we shld be out there learning more and i know that everyone has there weeknesses but come on now we should be practicing them so tht the mistakes arent happening in the fire ground and you end up hurtin one of your brothers/sisters in the brotherhood.
Greg, I didn't mean that as a bad thing; guy's get to whining about what we are doining and want somthing different, as refered to above "latest and greatest" Always makes me think about that quote.
Understand, no bad thing. I know our brothers and sisters are lookingfor something to hold there attention in regards to training. I can say I do also. Lets face it boring is boring, but at times required. Yes I am stuck on the "you must train" stance. I also am a firm beleiver that 100% compliance in training is at times impossible. The fact is though training makes a difference and promotes the service, individuals and the community. It saves lives and property. It also gives us a chance to be in the company of some of the greatest people on this earth and get to know our brothers and sisters better. I feel that its a win win for all of us and I dont take offense to anyones comments. This is a place for all of us to voice ourselves and I would hope that everybody does so,for me its another leaning experience. I also enjoy the different points of views on so many subjects. Thanks
I agree. Hands on training is important,very important. The more"hands on" The more experience gained the better the firefighter. It has been my experence training with a dept. that trained once a week, Yes thats once a week, that more personel showed up for hands on training than classroom. Nobody like sitting on the tiller hour after hour in the dungeon. However, very usefull knowledge can be gained by both types of training. I have seen training that used both types of training together in a single rotation that was very effective and very common around this area. I also agree that the last place for mistakes is on the fire ground, It is o.k. to make mistakes on training and then learn from them, let us not make those mistakes because of lack of training and on scene. That is shamefull. Let us learn so we dont get burnt!
all I can say is that I am new to the volunteer Fire/EMS world....I truly hope that I get the proper training so that I can continue to build upon it during my time with the fire hall here in WNY. During my probation time I truly hope that my instructors and fellow fire/ems team are serious about the job......I don't wanna get into trouble and I certainly don't want anyone else with me to get into a situation that will be bad due to complacency
Well said Greg....I wish everyone had your attitude. Over the years I've noticed in just about every dept, mine included, 65% are in to it, 20% are somewhat in to it and 15% are just fillin numbers.
I had an oldtimes tell me once "Son, you ain't gotta like it, you just gotta do it." Pretty much sums it up I think...Yes, might be boring, might seem too basic...but it is just like the EMS field...We alway say...."Paramedics save lives, But, EMT's save Paramedics"....You will never go wrong with good, strong basics no matter the field....And yes, we train frequently in al fields including the basics.....Paul
Basics. They shouldn't be trained on "now and then", they should be trained on ALL THE TIME! Ladders, pump ops, fire ground tactics, ppv, tools, chainsaws, medical care, etc, etc. It surprises me that departments don't.

I would rather be prepared than be injured or dead.
I'm the volunteer training officer for our two stations. When I took over training a few years back I took everything back to the basics because everything we do is dependent of a strong foundation of basic skills. After a few months you could really see a difference in performance, and surprisingly training attendance increased, often to 100%.

Our situation is different from most in that we are part of a county wide fire service that provides all the annually required training at quarterly inservices, and routinely offers specialized training sessions for advanced skills. This allows us the luxury of using station training the way we do.

It gets to be a balancing act at times, trying to make it where training is interesting enough where it doesn't bore your 10 year veterans but not too far advanced for the 6 month rookies....but one way I combat that is to utilize the senior personnel as instructors. This gives them a sense of ownership in the training process, and utilizes their skills and experiences teaching the young dogs old tricks.

I have also learned to be flexible with my training schedule. On several calls a few years back I noticed we looked like the proverbial monkey with football while putting up ground ladders, so we adapted our training until now ground ladders are second nature. This past month we did driver training because of an upcoming Emergency Vehicle Drivers Training class and our personnel needing the extra skill training in order to get the proper DL to take the class.

Evidently I have hit on what works because the past two years I have done surveys and almost to a man my guys want to continue working on the basics.

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